August 26, 2019, 02:04:51 AM
Dyatlov Pass Forum

Author Topic: Korovina's group tragedy  (Read 874 times)

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February 27, 2019, 09:25:25 AM
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Kopyrda


Recently posted on Dyatlov's Pass profile on Facebook
https://www.rbth.com/history/330020-russia-dyatlov-pass-mystery-analogues?fbclid=IwAR0RgqXqyrVfeoKwDxSciuWR-vjoSkrs-d0nyhSSly2BnXkIkkcaB_wK0Cc
Utochenko's testimony seems to come from some kind of horror scenario, not something that would happen in real life. "Suddenly one of the guys got a foam from his mouth, blood poured from his ears - in front of everyone, 24-year-old Alexander Krysin felt sick and died suddenly.
Next in the group began a complete chaos. It's amazing that this death inflicted panic not only on the 16-17-year-old participants of the campaign, but also on the leader - an experienced woman, a master of sports. What happened in the mountains, it is difficult to give an explanation - in the eyes of Valentina Uotchenko, who was maintaining her composure, a real madness was going on. "Denis began to hide behind the rocks and run away, Tatiana was banging her head against the stones, Victoria and Timur, probably went mad. Lyudmila Ivanovna died of a heart attack "- such data are recorded in the report on search and rescue and transportation work from the words of the surviving girl".

Should especially raise the interests of guys believing in infrasounds theory regarding Dyatlov's Pass.
"Holat-Vladimir Borzenkov, one of the first to deal with the case, came to the conclusion that the death of young hikers was due to the strong emissions of infrasound.
Some experts in analyzing the upper part of the two nearby mountains have drawn a straight line that unites them in an imaginary straight line along the wind-blown ridge that usually reaches speeds of about 15 meters per second. Experts believe that the death of young people is due to the strong emissions of infrasound, which could have emotionally influenced the group of walkers of the pass Dyatlov.
Despite the development of science, infrasound is still little known.
We only know that it is a low-frequency wave not perceptible by the human ear which would be able to alter the physical and mental state of the unfortunate listener.
Some scientists confirm that infrasound could induce people to panic, terror, to the point of infarct.
The strong winds on the sea or in the mountains, the storms and the northern lights could be one of the reasons for the birth of these mysterious infrasound.
Now the researchers are convinced that the mysterious deaths of the members of the two expeditions could represent the irrefutable proof of the existence of a disturbing sound killer that could also be generated by the friction of terrestrial faults capable of generating strong energy emissions to the full of their constant movement".
Reference source: baikal-daily.ru

Although, there are also different explanations - that they had all suffered from pulmonary edema brought on by a combination of high altitude, protein deficiency caused by malnutrition and panic after the initial collapse of Krysin, which would have spiked their blood pressure. The cause of death is ruled as hypothermia, and while some articles mention the state of undress some bodies were found in as a contradiction, this is called paradoxical undressing and is often seen in the final stages of hypothermia.
« Last Edit: February 27, 2019, 09:55:45 AM by Kopyrda »

February 27, 2019, 11:55:52 AM
Reply #1
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Nigel Evans


Interesting article. One possibility that comes to mind is sudden decompression creating gas embolisms, burst eardrums etc. Air moving over a ridge could decrease in pressure like over a plane's wing. The position of the survivor relative to the group would be important for the theory to work.

February 27, 2019, 12:36:03 PM
Reply #2
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sarapuk

Case-Files Achievement Recipient
Recently posted on Dyatlov's Pass profile on Facebook
https://www.rbth.com/history/330020-russia-dyatlov-pass-mystery-analogues?fbclid=IwAR0RgqXqyrVfeoKwDxSciuWR-vjoSkrs-d0nyhSSly2BnXkIkkcaB_wK0Cc
Utochenko's testimony seems to come from some kind of horror scenario, not something that would happen in real life. "Suddenly one of the guys got a foam from his mouth, blood poured from his ears - in front of everyone, 24-year-old Alexander Krysin felt sick and died suddenly.
Next in the group began a complete chaos. It's amazing that this death inflicted panic not only on the 16-17-year-old participants of the campaign, but also on the leader - an experienced woman, a master of sports. What happened in the mountains, it is difficult to give an explanation - in the eyes of Valentina Uotchenko, who was maintaining her composure, a real madness was going on. "Denis began to hide behind the rocks and run away, Tatiana was banging her head against the stones, Victoria and Timur, probably went mad. Lyudmila Ivanovna died of a heart attack "- such data are recorded in the report on search and rescue and transportation work from the words of the surviving girl".

Should especially raise the interests of guys believing in infrasounds theory regarding Dyatlov's Pass.
"Holat-Vladimir Borzenkov, one of the first to deal with the case, came to the conclusion that the death of young hikers was due to the strong emissions of infrasound.
Some experts in analyzing the upper part of the two nearby mountains have drawn a straight line that unites them in an imaginary straight line along the wind-blown ridge that usually reaches speeds of about 15 meters per second. Experts believe that the death of young people is due to the strong emissions of infrasound, which could have emotionally influenced the group of walkers of the pass Dyatlov.
Despite the development of science, infrasound is still little known.
We only know that it is a low-frequency wave not perceptible by the human ear which would be able to alter the physical and mental state of the unfortunate listener.
Some scientists confirm that infrasound could induce people to panic, terror, to the point of infarct.
The strong winds on the sea or in the mountains, the storms and the northern lights could be one of the reasons for the birth of these mysterious infrasound.
Now the researchers are convinced that the mysterious deaths of the members of the two expeditions could represent the irrefutable proof of the existence of a disturbing sound killer that could also be generated by the friction of terrestrial faults capable of generating strong energy emissions to the full of their constant movement".
Reference source: baikal-daily.ru

Although, there are also different explanations - that they had all suffered from pulmonary edema brought on by a combination of high altitude, protein deficiency caused by malnutrition and panic after the initial collapse of Krysin, which would have spiked their blood pressure. The cause of death is ruled as hypothermia, and while some articles mention the state of undress some bodies were found in as a contradiction, this is called paradoxical undressing and is often seen in the final stages of hypothermia.


Very interesting story about the demise of the KOROVINA GROUP. There doesnt appear to be much in the English language about the Incident. From what I gather there was a SURVIVOR. The survivor tells of members of the Group behaving strangely. One member has blood coming from the ear and foam from the mouth. Members are later found with gaping orbits ie eyes missing  !  ?  At first after reading what little information I found, I thought maybe Altitude sickness was to blame. But they had not climbed a very high Mountain, so Altitude sickness can surely be ruled out  !  ?

The story of the demise of the SHATAYEVA GROUP,  seems to have even less information. All the Group died on the Mountain. And it was a big Mountain. So maybe a natural cause caused their demise. There is a book by the husband of ELVIRA SHATAYEVA, translated into English from Russian, titled ''Degrees of Difficulty'' in which he describes his climb to retrieve the bodies of his wife and her Group.
DB

February 27, 2019, 01:47:05 PM
Reply #3
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Kopyrda


Unfortunatelly, non-Russians are screwed when it comes to investigation of such cases. I found a lengthy video on youtube, but of course... it's from Russian television. Maybe some native speaker cares to watch it and share some insight?

April 12, 2019, 10:42:22 AM
Reply #4
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Ehtnisba


I am very interested in that more recent tragedy ,and tried to find more info. Here is a much longer article with a lot of information about the search and how the survived girl could go down. The article is translated with google in English:
https://m.ru.sputniknews.kz/society/20170824/3076927/poslednij-pohod-zagadochnaya-gibel-kazahstancev-vblizi-bajkala.html?mobile_return=no

Here are some points I found interesting :

If you collect the memories of different people who have happened to hear the girl’s story about what happened, the following picture is obtained.
... On the night of 4 to 5 August, there was bad weather - a thunderstorm rattled, a hurricane of such strength raged below that it was falling trees ... In the morning, at 11 o'clock, Alexander, the oldest and strongest of the guys, became ill. He fell. Nose, mouth and ears were bleeding. It is worth noting here that the head of the group raised the guy from childhood and therefore practically considered her son. She decides to stay with him, and instructs other children to try to descend lower to the edge of the forest zone. Senior appointed Denis. But - after a while two girls fall at once. They start rolling, tearing their clothes, grabbing their throats. Following them with similar symptoms fell Timur. Valentina was left alone with Denis. He offers - grab the most necessary of backpacks and run down. Valentina bent over a backpack to pull out a sleeping bag. When the girl looked up, Denis was already lying on the ground. Grabbing a sleeping bag, Valentina ran down. She spent the night under a stone, on the edge of the forest zone. Trees piled near like matches. The next morning the girl rose back - Lyudmila Ivanovna was still alive, but - on the last gasp. She showed how and where to go. "

Here's how the events are described from the words of the surviving girl in the report on search-and-rescue and transportation works: Denis began to hide behind the stones and run away, Tatiana beat her head against the stones, Victoria and Timur probably went astray. Lyudmila Ivanovna died of a heart attack. "

After collecting food and taking the card in the things of the head, on August 6, Valentina went in search of salvation. The search lasted for three days.
The girl went down to the river Anigte, where she spent the night of August 7th. The next day, she stumbled upon an abandoned relay tower at an altitude of 2,310 meters, where she spent another night all alone. The next morning, noticing the pillars going down, the tourist, in the hope that they would lead her to the people, set off on the road. However, the houses to which the wires were connected turned out to be abandoned.
But soon the girl went to the river Snow and went downstream. She had to spend the night here again, so that she could continue searching for people the next day. Having gone 7-8 kilometers, emaciated, she stopped and spread her sleeping bag on the bushes by the water. That is the meaning of the presence of lost tourists. At this time, a group of tourists from Kiev made a raft down the river, and they picked up the girl. Even in this case, Valentina is extremely lucky - they say that people are rarely in those places ...

At first, the girl did not talk to the tourists who had saved her - she was in great shock and was exhausted. As a result, whether as it “returns to life”, or because of the unwillingness (or prohibition) of rescuers to search for the dead tourists ... those were found only on 26 August.

The picture on arrival at the scene of the tragedy appeared depressing: mummified bodies, grimaces of horror on their faces ... Almost all of the dead were dressed in thin tights, while three were barefoot. The head Korovina lay on top of Alexandra.
The dead were buried only a month later - our delegates for more than two weeks sought the right to take the departed to their native land ...

... The bodies were taken by helicopter. The head of the search group "Search", lawyer Nikolai Fyodorov, who at that time was in the rescue expedition team, recalls that when information about the tragedy arrived, he and his colleagues were sent by plane to the scene.

“We were all assembled and sent to the scene of a team of six people. There was a task to find the bodies of the dead. When we arrived, the bodies were already prepared. One feature that we were told by those who shot the dead from the mountain was the bodies lying in pairs, and at a decent distance from each other (40-50 meters), ”Nikolai Fedorov said.“ The bodies were opened in Ulan-Ude. According to the experts, everyone died from hypothermia ... "

A lot of similarities with Dyatlov Pass plus the main testimonies from the survivor are quite suspicious and unbelievable. Like they wrote she had even double luck by meeting people in a boat in that river where it was known that people rarely go.


April 12, 2019, 10:52:47 AM
Reply #5
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Ehtnisba


https://www.kp.ru/daily/26849.5/3891095/

Here is a video from the search and the dead bodies are visible .

Looking for guys for almost a week. And as they found, they were horrified. 25 years have passed since that day, and Golius talks about it with a shiver in his voice.

- It was a scary picture. The guys were lying on a small ledge, someone huddled together, someone a little distance away. No eye. In the empty sockets and parted mouths worms crawling. We packed the bodies in plastic bags. When they flew to Ulan-Ude, the smell in the helicopter was impossible, some of the men were sick.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2019, 11:07:42 AM by Ehtnisba »

April 12, 2019, 01:18:43 PM
Reply #6
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sarapuk

Case-Files Achievement Recipient
Its easy to get carried away with another mystery. So I think look only for any specific similarities with the Dyatlov Incident, other wise we end up investigating another mystery.
DB

April 12, 2019, 08:13:52 PM
Reply #7
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Ehtnisba


I think there are a lot of similarities:
- undressing
- no shoes
- out of the forest on a bare hill
- delay of the search with 2-3 weeks
- main purpose of the search "find the bodies"
- 1 survivor
- no eyes (although this is not so surprising in the summer )
- dying of hypothermia according to autopsies, searchers say not possible in summer (in Dyatlov case we have also pretty high temperatures for the season and doubtful hypothermia)

Interesting is that a mountain lifeguard explained the death with toxic rain (he thinks that is why the searchers waited 2 weeks) .
There are parallels and here we have a witness and more explanations that may be useful . Also color photography and even videos .

April 13, 2019, 01:07:19 PM
Reply #8
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sarapuk

Case-Files Achievement Recipient
I think there are a lot of similarities:
- undressing
- no shoes
- out of the forest on a bare hill
- delay of the search with 2-3 weeks
- main purpose of the search "find the bodies"
- 1 survivor
- no eyes (although this is not so surprising in the summer )
- dying of hypothermia according to autopsies, searchers say not possible in summer (in Dyatlov case we have also pretty high temperatures for the season and doubtful hypothermia)

Interesting is that a mountain lifeguard explained the death with toxic rain (he thinks that is why the searchers waited 2 weeks) .
There are parallels and here we have a witness and more explanations that may be useful . Also color photography and even videos .

Yes there are some similarities. But do we investigate this case in order to help us with our main case  !  ? Its difficult enough with the Dyatlov Case.
DB

April 14, 2019, 05:59:07 AM
Reply #9
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Ehtnisba


I think Korovina case is at least a factor to show the people, that nothing paranormal happened . No aliens,no yetis   . So ,yes,it is helpful for Dyatlov Pass case. Radioactive fog explains running downhill from the tent .

April 15, 2019, 04:40:18 AM
Reply #10
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Nigel Evans


Maybe some form of poisoning, berries, mushrooms, ergot etc. Did she eat the final meal with the others?

April 15, 2019, 07:11:30 AM
Reply #11
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WAB


I think there are a lot of similarities:

No. It is very little. We will begin that difference that is winter and it is summer. This is core.

- undressing
- no shoes

It is natural. People sleep in tents at night, therefore undress.

- out of the forest on a bare hill
- delay of the search with 2-3 weeks

No. On Khamar-Daban searches have begun through 1 … 2 days after Ms. Utonchenko has informed about this event. Faster on it turns out, especially if it is necessary involve aircraft. Searches proceeded not long. Delays were because Utonchenko could not specify exact place and all time rescuers searched not there.

- main purpose of the search "find the bodies"

When it becomes known that people were lost, other task do not put. If only who that needs understand why it has occurred.

- 1 survivor

This is difference, instead of coincidence.

- no eyes (although this is not so surprising in the summer )

It is no truth. It is result of hearings and gossips. There all was on one place at victims. There was few damages from birds of prey.

- dying of hypothermia according to autopsies, searchers say not possible in summer (in Dyatlov case we have also pretty high temperatures for the season and doubtful hypothermia)

It is no truth. In the summer people die of overcooling even at positive temperature on Celsius. Here picture frozen at temperature +2С on Kola peninsula in August 2002. I was there at this time.



There were cases of  death from overcooling and at +5. 7С.

Interesting is that a mountain lifeguard explained the death with toxic rain (he thinks that is why the searchers waited 2 weeks) .
There are parallels and here we have a witness and more explanations that may be useful . Also color photography and even videos .

Acid rains go across all Earth. But it not such global factor which could ruin group in this place.
I have one familiar lady who was the female friend Lyudmila Korovina. By the way her husband is the brother Alexander Krysin. They do not like speak about this history, but some years ago we discussed it on correspondence. They consider that poor-quality products which at that time were in large quantities delivered from abroad because were very cheap could be the reason. I was at them time in his traveller club much earlier and have paid attention that they were fond of use of natural vegetative stimulators of power, for example, Rhodíola rósea - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhodiola_rosea . This root grows on mountains Khamar-Daban in considerable quantity and if it use much for once such event could be. Especially if there was combination of poor-quality products and overdose of drink Rhodíola rósea. Though even one big overdose of this drink can be give such effect.
In this case, as well as in a case with Dyatlov group, lot of "the garbage" information. To that is not known add many conjectures and imaginations. It is necessary understand these cases very deeply if it is necessary will come nearer to true. Will come nearer, instead find it definitively. It is impossible because not enough trustworthy information.
By the way concerning infrasound. I was on this place, only in winter and many years ago. If I correctly remember conditions in this place there conditions for this phenomenon are not present. But I can be mistaken, because it was for long time and I cannot remember all to fine details. Namely they also separate true from fictions in considerable quantity of cases.

April 15, 2019, 12:42:37 PM
Reply #12
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Ehtnisba


It is really hard to discern truth from imagination when only witnesses are telling the "facts"... i am really confused from the Utochenko testimonies. They change all the time. First we have her saying they were banging their heads in rocks and blood everywhere, then she says that there was strong wind and the wind banged them against the rocks . One time she mentions fog, then no fog. I know this was a very stressful experience for her and she may have discrepancies in her memories...but again....
There is a video from the search group and in this video the bodies are visible ,and they were with no blood at all.
Searcher that transported the bodies allegedly said 'bodies were badly rotten with no eyes and worms, the smell was terrible and the look of them was also horrible" But as I said, there is nothing weird if they were with no eyes after 2 weeks in + temperature and rain and animals .
Well , maybe the main point is that having the survivor here we may see how such tragedy happen and there are no aliens and yetis involved. This is my main point here with this case. It helps to dismiss several wild theories about Dyatlov Pass in my opinion and it is useful for people to read about it. Specially Utochenko testimonies about the strong wind and how cold they were in the morning.
Another witness was saying what you said - poor diet..he thinks Korovina had practised survival school and was having very little food with them. Utochenko denies and says they had plenty of food and they didn:t consume a lot from said plant. After all autopsies found protein deficiency so I tend to believe they were on a very poor diet. Which again may be assumed for Dyatlov group - they ate what? Garlic, bread, ham,porridge and cacao ..is this sufficient for such trip in the harsh winter?

April 15, 2019, 12:51:58 PM
Reply #13
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sarapuk

Case-Files Achievement Recipient
I think Korovina case is at least a factor to show the people, that nothing paranormal happened . No aliens,no yetis   . So ,yes,it is helpful for Dyatlov Pass case. Radioactive fog explains running downhill from the tent .

I think we can not say for certain that nothing paranormal or Alien or whatever happened ! ?
DB

April 15, 2019, 12:59:17 PM
Reply #14
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sarapuk

Case-Files Achievement Recipient
It is really hard to discern truth from imagination when only witnesses are telling the "facts"... i am really confused from the Utochenko testimonies. They change all the time. First we have her saying they were banging their heads in rocks and blood everywhere, then she says that there was strong wind and the wind banged them against the rocks . One time she mentions fog, then no fog. I know this was a very stressful experience for her and she may have discrepancies in her memories...but again....
There is a video from the search group and in this video the bodies are visible ,and they were with no blood at all.
Searcher that transported the bodies allegedly said 'bodies were badly rotten with no eyes and worms, the smell was terrible and the look of them was also horrible" But as I said, there is nothing weird if they were with no eyes after 2 weeks in + temperature and rain and animals .
Well , maybe the main point is that having the survivor here we may see how such tragedy happen and there are no aliens and yetis involved. This is my main point here with this case. It helps to dismiss several wild theories about Dyatlov Pass in my opinion and it is useful for people to read about it. Specially Utochenko testimonies about the strong wind and how cold they were in the morning.
Another witness was saying what you said - poor diet..he thinks Korovina had practised survival school and was having very little food with them. Utochenko denies and says they had plenty of food and they didn:t consume a lot from said plant. After all autopsies found protein deficiency so I tend to believe they were on a very poor diet. Which again may be assumed for Dyatlov group - they ate what? Garlic, bread, ham,porridge and cacao ..is this sufficient for such trip in the harsh winter?

But you are assuming that there was a main similarity with the way that the Dyatlov Group met their demise  !  ?  But you can not produce any real evidence to back this up, so its just a pure assumption.
DB

April 15, 2019, 10:50:12 PM
Reply #15
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Ehtnisba


Of course it is an assumption. Everything about Dyatlov Pass is an assumption. What evidence do you want me to provide 60 years later, thousands of kilometers away from the pass?
I listed my points in what I find these cases similar.
The survivor proves there were no aliens or yetis. She may have disrupted memory, but I don't think that if she had seen fire orb or flying saucer  she would have forgotten it just like that . Fact is Utochenko didn't see anything supernatural up there. Wind, rain, cold, people crawling against the wind falling down of exhaustion from poor diet and overcooling during the night  .

April 16, 2019, 11:23:58 AM
Reply #16
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sarapuk

Case-Files Achievement Recipient
Of course it is an assumption. Everything about Dyatlov Pass is an assumption. What evidence do you want me to provide 60 years later, thousands of kilometers away from the pass?
I listed my points in what I find these cases similar.
The survivor proves there were no aliens or yetis. She may have disrupted memory, but I don't think that if she had seen fire orb or flying saucer  she would have forgotten it just like that . Fact is Utochenko didn't see anything supernatural up there. Wind, rain, cold, people crawling against the wind falling down of exhaustion from poor diet and overcooling during the night  .

Not everything about Dyatlov Pass is an assumption. Iam not asking you to provide evidence. The survivor in the case you mention apparently was a bit confused, as we should expect from such an ordeal. The fact that she saw no UFO's etc doesnt mean that there wasnt any such objects in the sky at the time. And it doesnt impact on the Dyatlov Case either.
DB