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Dyatlov Pass Forum

Author Topic: Basic guestions about tragedy  (Read 650 times)

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February 13, 2022, 02:38:59 AM
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Osi


Question: What was the root cause of this tragedy? Answer: I don't know if this is the official way. Had they passed through Lozva, the river would have brought them to Otorten. They preferred Auspia and had to follow a horizontal path to return to Lozva when the river ran out. This horizontal line was not easy like Auspiya. There was no river to follow. The snow was so heavy that it made walking impossible. Even if they passed the pass, before them was a dense forest stretching for miles. We can say that a little worry of getting lost, a little walking difficulty encouraged them to go to Otorten on the open slopes. I think these decisions are the cause of the tragedy. Question: OK, they will walk on slopes. So why did they set up the tent on the slope? They can go down to the forest border and set it up. Answer: This is where weather conditions come into play. From Labaz to Kholat ridge there was mild weather. They hadn't thought of camping on the slope. They were going to land in Lozva. However, it started to get dark and they would stay in the dark to start tent preparations to land in Lozva, which was risky. And they gave up. They were deceived by the soft Kholat air and decided to spend the night on the hillside. Question; What are the must-haves for camping on this slope? Answer:Dyatlov; He was experienced enough to know that a surprise storm might come at night. For this, you need to have a solid tent. Yes, the tent had been repaired a lot, but it was enough. Sturdy ropes to keep the tent up, spare dry clothes and of course a stove (you can't start a fire outside), enough wood. In this case, all the researchers who were convinced that the tent was set up on the slope; They need to see that they don't have enough wood as the temperature drops to -50 degrees at night. The contradiction begins here. Because before an avalanche, storm, earthquake or explosion, we should look at the tent conditions. Solution? Here, the necessity of dividing the group into two arises. 5 or 6 people will prepare the tent, 3 or 4 people will bring water and wood from the forest. When you look from the slope, the forest is not far away. The air is still bright and the distance must have deceived those who went into the forest. Dry branches of the cedar tree may have broken off before disaster struck. .Maybe these branches are broken for tent.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2022, 03:04:10 AM by Osi »
 

February 13, 2022, 07:13:58 AM
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GlennM


Osi. A good review. A good analysis. I believe they kept to open country for efficiency. Better line of sight, better use of compass, less calories consumed. The trouble begins by separating the hikers at camp. No wood was taken from Auspia ridgeline for evening fire when all hiked together is a big mistake. Sending sub group to Lozva treeline for wood is the econd mistake. Not setting up of the stove iin anticipation of firewood is a big mystery.  Taking off outer clothes in a cold tent irrational behavior. Cutting up their only shelter that they did not own, permissible only in the most extreme situation. Gathering firewood without skis for travel or use as a stretcher to carry collected wood is unintelligent.
As strange as this is Osi, I believe it is much less likely that a crime was perpetuated on the group. Please consider my thoughts as I have of yours. There is hidden truth surrounding that tent.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2022, 04:35:28 PM by GlennM »
 

February 13, 2022, 08:08:10 AM
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Osi


Gleen
1) Camping was not planned on the slope. Therefore, there was no need to carry extra wood to the slope. 2) The stove was filled with some firewood for emergencies, but only for 1/3 of the night. 3) The Lozva valley stood very close. However, the wood carriers could not find quality fuel nearby and went as far as the cedar. 4) The tent had just been set up. The beds would be prepared first. Everyone should take off their coats to lay them out. Bags and blankets on them. After entering the tent and making the beds, the stove would be lit. (10 minutes after taking off the coat only) 5) The wood to be transported from the forest was to be used for the later hours of the night or for a day's rest in the morning kholat. 6) There is no need for extra equipment to carry wood. It is sufficient if everyone brings 5 ​​branches with a diameter of 5 cm in their lap.Everyone should bring 5 branches of wood with a diameter of 5 cm.
 

February 13, 2022, 01:47:42 PM
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Manti


There is a necessity for some kind of vessel to bring water though, and nothing like that was found with them in the forest. So they went only for wood, not water?

Also you say they set up camp on the slope because it got dark. Isn't it a bit dangerous to then go into an unknown area in the dark for wood? There might be a cliff. They might fall into a stream. They can't judge ice thickness in the dark.
 

February 13, 2022, 04:42:59 PM
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GlennM


Manti has a good point. Osi has a good explanation of the situation. I do not believe that destroying hiking club property in order to answer someone's cry for help is necessary, nor wise. I think if people left the tent to go help their friends, they would bring rope or splints or a stretcher to carry injured friends. They most certainly would have taken the alcohol. Yes?
 

February 13, 2022, 05:47:55 PM
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Manti


They didn't bring alcohol (at least according to Yuri Yudin's testimony and their inventory).

Another mistery then about the flask with the smell of alcohol found in the tent. Someone will say soldiers who staged the tent forgot it there. It could also be from the hikers, for example they drank a sort of fruit drink made from syrup (compote?)... maybe during 1 month its remains fermented in the flask? Although... it was too cold for that
 

February 13, 2022, 08:33:42 PM
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GlennM


I can imagine a hiker coming back from the forest saying, help! My friends have fallen and hurt themselves badly. I can not imagine those in the tent cutting their way out to help. I can not imagine them going to help injured friends 5,000 yards away with no boots, nor warm clothes on. I can not imagine going to rescue with no first aid supplies, blanket, nor rope. These were grade 2 hikers, experienced. I do not think it acceptable for the group to split up over such a distance. Footprints suggest all went to the forest together, yes?
 

February 13, 2022, 08:55:08 PM
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Osi


Why do we exaggerate the distance so much? Looking from the 880-altitude hill, Sharavin was able to see the snow-covered corpses of 2 Yuri. The distance from the 880-altitude hill to the cedar is almost equal to the distance of the tent to the cedar. It was not yet dark, and the cedar tree was perhaps an obvious target for those descending into the forest. ..And those above could still see them.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2022, 10:06:22 PM by Osi »
 

February 14, 2022, 03:44:38 AM
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Ziljoe


Why do we exaggerate the distance so much? Looking from the 880-altitude hill, Sharavin was able to see the snow-covered corpses of 2 Yuri. The distance from the 880-altitude hill to the cedar is almost equal to the distance of the tent to the cedar. It was not yet dark, and the cedar tree was perhaps an obvious target for those descending into the forest. ..And those above could still see them.

Osi ,

Sharavin was able to see the snow-covered corpses of 2 Yuri.

Where does it say this?



 

February 14, 2022, 04:00:28 AM
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Osi


Sharavin 2007röportaj
remained to the right, but at the same time we went to the right of the remnant (the memorial - ed. note). If you look here, this pass... further to the south... here is the pass, here is the mountain ... from here, it says 880 on these maps. They say that the altitudes have changed since. Here it the 880. Here somewhere is the remnant... we’re probably literally... or maybe, since we got up from there (map), we even like that ... Because we went down in that direction. when we climbed here began to look down, it became clear that there ... there weren’t such birch trees yet, like now, after 48 years - everything is overgrown with birch trees, but then this cedar stood out very well, it was like some kind of that hillock. Such a little mound but it stood out very prominently, so we went there right away. We arrived at the cedar and then found them. Because there the snow was swept out under the cedar and it was very clear, the undergrowth was small, there was a lot of snow, the bushes were visible and we were skiing down (map), these bushes were not in the way.

– 3 –

AK: Who found them? Because in one book it says that you and Slobtsov show up later, when the bodies were already found?

MSh: In one book it says that we didn’t find the cedar, but allegedly Brusnitsyn with someone, this can't be true, because it is not something that you forget, we were the first to go together, there was nobody else there, with Yuri Koptelov. We walked side by side, went down together and literally 10 meters, or 15, before reaching the cedar, we saw something black, because the blanket was on top, it was not covered, it stood out. We approach and immediately... then we began to observe. We see traces of the fire, and the fire was on the same side [of the cedar] from which the guys were lying, and some branches were broken, we could see this. See here is this book... in the dictionary it says: “CEDAR is an eternally green tree. Under a huge cedar growing on the slope of the mountain on February 26” - this is wrong, it was not the 26th, but the 27th,- "Slobtsov discovered two bodies." Slobtsov was not here on the 26th. We found the tent with him, this is the day before. And this happened on the 27th and we were with Yuri Koptelov.
 

February 14, 2022, 10:40:44 AM
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Osi


There is a necessity for some kind of vessel to bring water though, and nothing like that was found with them in the forest. So they went only for wood, not water?

Also you say they set up camp on the slope because it got dark. Isn't it a bit dangerous to then go into an unknown area in the dark for wood? There might be a cliff. They might fall into a stream. They can't judge ice thickness in the dark.
There is more than 1 hour (bright) time advantage between being in the evening/being in the dark. This is between 17:00 / 18:30 in February for northern latitude countries. The tent began to be excavated at 17:00. Entered at 18:30. The group started going to the forest at 17.00 and returning to the tent at 18.30. So no one was forced to work in the dark. My answer to the first question is; I don't know if there is a water bowl. Maybe he fell into a creek and got stuck in snow and was carried away by water in the following days. My more serious claim is that Lydula fell, got injured and his boots got wet. Lyudila's boots were also lost in that stream.