Theories Discussion > KGB / Radiation / Military involvement
Measuring contamination on clothing - Table 2
Star man:
--- Quote from: Ryan on March 01, 2019, 08:00:21 PM ---
--- Quote from: Star man on February 28, 2019, 11:42:00 PM ---
Thanks Ryan for that detailed analysis. So from what you are saying all samples taken were contaminated? Therefore it is reasonable to assume that it is likely that there was widespread contamination on the hikers?
No wonder the military helicopter pilots wanted the bodies in zinc coffins.
--- End quote ---
Thank you!
Yes, all nine pieces of clothing tested, with at least one piece of clothing from each of the four hikers found in the ravine, was significantly contaminated above background. The level of contamination differed between them, with some being above industrial safety limits and others not, but all were contaminated to some extent.
I'd like to refer you to case file page 370. Ivanov gave all of the four hikers' clothing and some bone / tissue samples to the radiation lab in Sverdlovsk. The report from the lab does not say how the nine clothing samples to test were determined. There may be some sampling bias. I would not necessarily presume the samples are random. It is possible that they scanned all the clothes with a beta sensitive pancake probe and cherry picked the hottest parts to test. But still, the fact remains that all four of the hikers was wearing at least one article of contaminated clothing.
It is a stretch, but I might believe that just one of the hikers in the nuclear industry "brought his work home with him" so to speak, and contaminated his clothes with beta emitters. Even that is a stretch; I see a distinction between protective work clothes that one would wear when handling radioactive substances, everyday clothing that one would wear going to and from the office, and what one would take on a winter expedition in the Urals.
But all four out of four hikers tested having contaminated clothing? No way. No occupational mistakes or sloppy college lab work could explain it. Something happened on the hike or after they died that, at a minimum, contaminated the clothing of all four of the ravine hikers. Period. Paragraph.
As to the helicopter pilot and the demand for zinc coffins (assuming it is true; yes I've seen it on the Internet, but does anyone have an authoritative source citation?), it is a compete and utter overreaction. Unfortunately, the average person has no concept of actual danger regarding radiation. As long as the corpses were wrapped in water tight tarps, there would be no danger at all to the pilot or any future occupants of the helicopter.
--- End quote ---
It is also probably the case that some of the clothes samples belonged to Dubinina and Semyon, and we're not borrowed from Krivonishenko and Kolevatov who may have worked with these substances. It is unlikely that all of the clothing would have been cross contaminated.
Was there any specific results for the bone samples? I wouldnt expect that much of the radioactivity would have made it into the blood stream through as it would probably get caught in the lungs, and stomach.
Given what they found, why is there no further info or results on other tissues. Would expect an analysis of the thyroid for Iodine 131?
Ryan:
--- Quote from: Star man on March 01, 2019, 03:21:18 PM ---I would have thought that if even if they found some evidence of radioactive contamination, then a much more extensive survey of the area and checks of all items would have been carried out. Not just a few clothes samples. Again it's very strange.
I think Ryan has a good grasp of the technical subject so should be able to shed some light on the case files.
--- End quote ---
YES YES YES! That lab report raises more questions than it answers.
What about the other five's clothing? What about the tent? The soles of the boots they left behind? And the clothing they weren't wearing, stored in their backpacks? These are quick and easy things to test, assuming the items are still being held as evidence.
Then, I'd want to do a radiological survey of the site where the hikers were found. Is the land itself contaminated, and with what?
I don't know what else, if anything, was checked. Then again, I haven't dug into the source material beyond the radiation report. It's clear from Ivanov's order (p. 370) that Ivanov already knew the clothes were contaminated. How? What kind of radiological inspection had already been made?
But this assumes that the goal is to find the truth. It seems Ivanov was in a hurry to close the case.
Maybe they reached the limits of the resources that could be spent on the case. They found all the bodies. The radiation was not anywhere near enough to be a hazard or a cause of death. None showed obvious signs of being murdered by typical means. There were no suspects to investigate or prosecute. So maybe they had to move on.
And it's also possible that Ivanov was pressured to close the case, and possibly cover something up, hence the reason that further radiological testing may not have been done.
Monika:
But would he wear the touring jacket and trousers at the work? No. And if he worked with a radioactive material, why only clothes had been contaminated and not his hair and skin?
If it was contamination from work, and as it turned out, this radioactivity is washable with water, it would already be removed during their tour while walking in the snow and during skiing and sitting on the snow at pause break as photos shows. Therefore, the contamination more likely got on clothes in the Dyatlov pass and not before.
sarapuk:
--- Quote from: Star man on March 01, 2019, 03:21:18 PM ---
--- Quote from: sarapuk on March 01, 2019, 12:53:26 PM ---What we really need to know is what were the READOUTS of the GEIGER COUNTERS used at the site of the Incident ! ? All we have, if it is correct, is what Ivanov said ; That the Geiger Counter went crazy around the camp. Hardly a scientific report, is it ! ? Also why only BETA PARTICLES at the Laboratories ! ?
--- End quote ---
I would have thought that if even if they found some evidence of radioactive contamination, then a much more extensive survey of the area and checks of all items would have been carried out. Not just a few clothes samples. Again it's very strange.
I think Ryan has a good grasp of the technical subject so should be able to shed some light on the case files.
--- End quote ---
According to Ivanov, his Geiger Counter went crazy. And at some point scientists are supposedly involved with their Geiger Counters. If the area was sealed off for some time then maybe there was further Investigations going on ! ?
sarapuk:
--- Quote from: Monika on March 02, 2019, 11:48:33 AM ---But would he wear the touring jacket and trousers at the work? No. And if he worked with a radioactive material, why only clothes had been contaminated and not his hair and skin?
If it was contamination from work, and as it turned out, this radioactivity is washable with water, it would already be removed during their tour while walking in the snow and during skiing and sitting on the snow at pause break as photos shows. Therefore, the contamination more likely got on clothes in the Dyatlov pass and not before.
--- End quote ---
Yes I think most of us are probably thinking along those lines now. Any Radiation Particles are likely to have been picked up in the area of the Dyatlov Groups demise. Even though we are clearly lacking in all the Information, all roads lead to that probability.
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