Theories Discussion > General Discussion

Hubris and risk taking?

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Partorg:

--- Quote from: GlennM ---It would appear that getting there and back as inexpensively as practical would be desirable. The group certainly travelled as cheaply as they could as well as saving energy until they started their push on skis
--- End quote ---

Аgree.


--- Quote from: GlennM ---I'd like to explore your claim that a 30 meter difference in camp site could have made the difference. Do you believe, as I do that they set their tent in a hollow which allowed snow to accumulate and then break free?
--- End quote ---

Their last photo shows that they are digging into a slope of ~ 30°. This is a local increase in steepness on the terrace ledge. It extends upward no more than 3 meters. It is also 15 - 20 meters wide. It is not detected in modern measurements made by Shura, but in the last photo of the Dyatlovites team it is clearly visible. Apparently this is explained by the fact that there was less snow on the slope in January 1959 than during the measurements Shura. The top layer of snow from this area could have slipped onto the tent, flattening it and forcing the Dyatlovites by cutting the roof and get out in the clothes they were wearing when the tent fell.
In any case, the slope of the ski pole to the left of the entrance supports this assumption

GlennM:
This information is consistent with my hypothesis regarding what drove them out. Thanks.

GlennM:
Dyatlov Pass: Document  from Dyatlov Pass article on Sasha  says

A member of our community "Pass named after the Igor Dyatlov group", Mihail Antonov, told an interesting story. It would seem completely by accident that it turned out that his wife’s grandmother knew Alexander Kolevatov during her studies at UPI.

Here's how he tells it:

There was a dialogue: "And today we were at the cinema, about the Dyatlov group, where the students died..."

She interrupts: "I never liked Igor, he was too self-confident

When zi read theis i say a person who is making leadership decisions can be dead right or dead wrong, or put another way, if you are calm when everyone else is in a panic, then you do not have all the facts.

Axelrod:
Landscapes and elevations such as Dyatlov Pass are 10 miles from my home.
I have never climbed mountains in winter because there is no need, but I have often climbed in summer, usually for berries.
But 1079 is very far (and expensive) mountain for berries.

I can't understand what the danger is?
The main danger is snakes and heart problems for somebody.
Wolves and bears are not encountered, only wild boars and deer.

At a similar altitude as the place where the tent is set up. are the cities of Yerevan and Kislovodsk (if you know them).
It is funny to hear how my relative went crazy with this crazy idea of ​​an avalanche in such a place, and I want to reassure other people.
That's why I am here on this forum.

GlennM:
Axelrod compares the slope on 1079 to the slope where he lives. He discounts an avalanche. Axelrod does not contemplate what effect having a ditch digger change the slope on the path home. A ditch digger can create a ledge which can be a trip and fall hazard. Similarly the DP9 digging into the snow to level tha base of their tent also generates a steep angle immediately next to the tent. I believe this levelling of the snow bank and the subsequent collapse of the adjascent ledge affacted the tent. I am encouraged in this assessment because no rescuer observed an avalanche debris at the tent, though farther downhill footprints were obscured by a snow drift.

In a comparison, if Axelrod's path to home were changed by a levelled trench and if the shoveled dirt was thrown on the uphill side, then a combination of wind and rain might cause a slump with the natural effect of filling in the dug out trench.

Since this thread is actually about bold decisions, the whole comment on avalanche is beside the point. For the record, I do not think the DP9's method of erecting shelter was done in  conceit. There might be something about them having an imperfect understanding of layering of snow and ice to question their choice. However, in this thread, I submit that hubris in ignoring the Forrester's warning set a cascade of decisions which only affect people's behavior. Nature has no decision making ability and as such can neither be controlled nor reasoned with. It can only be predicted. If the persons doing the predicting do not have all the facts, then bad things happen to good people.

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