How in the world would Mr. Yudin know that detail in the first place?
He also claims that branches of an unexpected and different species of tree were found in the snow den.
https://dyatlovpass.com/yudin-notesHow in the world would Mr. Yudin know that detail in the first place?
He identified the bodies in the morgue.He also claims that branches of an unexpected and different species of tree were found in the snow den.
Yudin wrote: "it is said that the flooring was made with fir branches, but in fact there were only spruce trees around."
Could have fooled me.
(https://dyatlovpass.com/resources/340/Dyatlov-pass-trees.png)
https://dyatlovpass.com/yudin-notesHow in the world would Mr. Yudin know that detail in the first place?
He identified the bodies in the morgue.He also claims that branches of an unexpected and different species of tree were found in the snow den.
Yudin wrote: "it is said that the flooring was made with fir branches, but in fact there were only spruce trees around."
Could have fooled me.
(https://dyatlovpass.com/resources/340/Dyatlov-pass-trees.png)
He attributed to me that I allegedly identified the intimate parts of Zina's clothing and what the first five bodies were found in, but naturally I could not do this since I was not present at the autopsy and undressing of the bodies... I was naive and signed the inventory without reading it, firmly believing in the actions of the investigator.
In your expeditions to the area, did you obtain photographic or physical evidence of the fallen branch?
Hello Teddy,My theory is that the tent was at the cedar where the bodies of Krivonischenko and Doroshenko were found. And they were staged after that. The fact that their feet were undamaged confirms twice my theory. First they never walked anywhere, and second, they were washed at the morgue, then returned back.
Returned back from Ivdel morgue to Kholyat Syakhl?
Proof that the geologists were flying over and working at the area of the incident: https://dyatlovpass.com/aeromagnetic-survey-maps
Only the year is mentioned in this documents, how can you know that the flights took place in January and February, rather than in July or September?
Exploration was done in winter. In summer the area is a swamp.
So the years "59-60" means winter of 1959-1960? The flights were made during the winter after the tragedy? But if it was radiation detection or magnetic, what difference between winter and summer?But a searcher, Syunikaev, requested with a telegram the explosions to stop.
I don't understand... are you saying that these explosions were related to the death of the hikers? But if they were, how could your "conspirators" allow them during the time when tens of rescuers were in the mountains?
what does this imply for us? If the cause of death was obvious, so too would the answer be obvious. If the cause of death was not obvious and one step removed from the precipitating event, then all that follows is and always will be speculative. Therefore, no matter how clever we are in our logic and intuition, we, like Mr. Yudin have been spinning our wheels for six decades. That produces a deep rut.
Yes, I agree with most of this part and the deep rut is caused a lack of imagination for most, lack of courage for some, shame for others.
But the wounds at the head and at the ribs had Russian nicknames:
- Tабуретовка (from taburetka ‘stool’): 1. A form of sadism in prisons whereby an out of favour prisoner is hit around the head with a wooden stool or a small bench until he loses consciousness. 2. The same act performed on a political prisoner by an order of the NKVD (Drawings from the Gulag, p. 213)
- Pазбить фанеру (to crack the plywood): Breaking the victim’s chest with a hammer. (Drawings from the Gulag, p. 212)
And read also Euphrosinia Kersnovskaya's memoirs of the Norillag:
As he dictated to me [when performing autopsy at camp morgue], the picture cleared up, and there was no doubt that it was murder. Assassination with point-blank shots. Heads smashed by butts ... Rib cage, broken with a blunt object...
For people who knew how ugly and hellish was the backyard of the USSR, it was obvious... Taburetovka, Razbit faneru... Stooling, cracking the plywood... When horrors become so normal they receive a nickname. Zeks could write an autopsy of all 9 hikers with the complete description of all wounds using only the nicknames of their daily language.
In Butugychag camp (Лагерь Бутугычаг) in Magadan, the Soviets lost all remains of I don't know what and were methodically sawing (https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSL6_5ArpXswPlk85rkR_hPyEsct9KXFmPn3vYyuILpBZGbXwFaLlWrqczGFU-8GLEFW2M&usqp=CAU) the skulls of the dead prisoners... In more civilized part of the country they had nicknames, again, for punching with bayonets the skulls and chests of the dead Zeks...
Of course many things are not obvious in the DPI, they demand an effort, for the us who live in neighborhoods that have enjoyed civilization and peace for a long time. But I think it is impossible not to face the darkness, and anyway, in the end bones come to the surface:
https://syktyvkar.1istochnik.ru/news/109815
My conviction is that modernity forces us to face our horrors. It is impossible to have both modernity and oblivion. No way to escape. And as a consequence, you understand easily that all "natural" explanations of these stigmata left on the students, when they are nothing but the expression of a faith in oblivion, seem to me absolutely anti-modern and archaic... ;-)
Can one blow of a hammer break 6 ribs? I am asking about 1 blow, because if are more the fractures won't be in one line.Maybe you have in mind a hammer like this one:
(https://cf.shopee.com.my/file/308257e36a0e18a8e1bd83c7c76a5476)
But Zeks were working in mining, railroad construction, quarries, their tools were very different:
(https://pakistanhorizon.files.wordpress.com/2018/09/gulag-e1536498345725.jpg) (http://ostenta.net/dunc/images/workers4a.jpg)
"Hammer – a tool used by prisoners of the BelBaltLag, used for the construction of the White Sea-Baltic Canal (1931-1933). It was found in 2004 on the bottom of the canal, between Locks Nos. 10 and 11 during repair-works":
(http://www.gulagmuseum.org/getImage.do?object=1626379)
"It is part of the permanent exhibition in the Segezha Municipal Museum Centre. (Photo 19.08.2005). SIZE 18x10x10 cm."
There is no reason to doubt of the testimonies of the men and women who suffered from the soviet regime.
Baldaev said they they used to break the victim’s chest with a "hammer", Kersnovskaya saw the rib cage broken with a "blunt object", and in Kholyat Syakhl, it could have been done with a rock (Zolotaryov and Dubinina were found in the creek) or a foot kick. The point here is that they used to go after the rib cage, that it was done so commonly they had a special name for the practice (Pазбить фанеру: to crack the plywood) and a name telling how easy it was to crack it and how fragile it was... they did not call it "to crack the concrete" nor "to crack the steel beams"... "plywood".
Baldaev said they they used to break the victim’s chest with a "hammer", Kersnovskaya saw the rib cage broken with a "blunt object", and in Kholyat Syakhl, it could have been done with a rock (Zolotaryov and Dubinina were found in the creek) or a foot kick. The point here is that they used to go after the rib cage, that it was done so commonly they had a special name for the practice (Pазбить фанеру: to crack the plywood) and a name telling how easy it was to crack it and how fragile it was... they did not call it "to crack the concrete" nor "to crack the steel beams"... "plywood".
😁😁😁 grin1 yes I meant the ikea hammer. You guessed it. I also imagine thin legged stool and not doubting the testimonies but imaginig the rezults of taburetka and smashed ribs as very messy like from the Ikea one they should look. With 18sm long and monster thing I see the flail chest ideally . For 6 in Dubinina when I measured my chest 20sm is all my 6 ribs where hers are broken and I am 1.70m high. She was stated as less. Zolotarov is also thin framed and if I remember 1.70-1.74 as heith so THAT hammer fits ideally. Nikolay 2x3 square indented part in the whole ( was it 7sm crack?) cracked skull is exactly shape and size of my parents 70s taburetkas all the same produced in those years . I am from ex Soviet country so can relate to your theory.
I doubt attackers brought a sledgehammer at the mountain, they had other means to "crack the plywood": rocks from the creek, foot kicks.
Happy to have guessed... dance1
Audacious! It could fit with Syunikaev testimony:
-What were you told happened to the hikers?g
-We were told that the group went on a hike and died. But they were killed!
-Did you decide that yourself?
-No. The prisoners told us.
-How did they know?
-The prisoners knew all the news - and what was happening in the Far East, and in Irkutsk. And here, right under their nose, a tragedy happened. We, the convoy, lived with the convicts. And, of course, we discussed this case. So the convicts said - this is murder, but you are looking in the wrong place.
-So if the prisoners told you about the death of the hikers, then it turns out that one of the prisoners killed them?
-Although most of them were imprisoned for murder, but no, it was not the convicts who killed the hikers. By that time, I had served for the third year already and knew the convicts' habits well. They would not rush after the hikers into the mountains. There was nothing special to take from the group. No values to justify the risk. And if the convicts ran away, they tried to leave by railway. A fugitive cannot sit in the forest for a long time in winter. The dogs will find them while crawling in snowdrifts up to the waist.
-Did the investigators interview the prisoners?
-Do think so.
-How about you?
-No.
https://dyatlovpass.com/syunikaev-2021
Prisoners could know about a murder if they saw guards leaving their camp just before Feb. 01 and coming back just after (I think Syunikaev is right and the prisoners too). And specially if they saw these guards bringing a sledgehammer with them.
Reply #26
To add, I can't imagine a group of assailants chasing after a group of hikers, battling the same weather conditions and logistics of food and survival , carrying a heavy mallet to mush two people's rib cages. I don't get it.
Mansi and Russians used to carry heavy axes fixed at their backpacks:
https://dyatlovpass.com/resources/340/gallery/1S-06.jpg (https://dyatlovpass.com/resources/340/gallery/1S-06.jpg)
And anyway, with vintage ski boots, they could inflict the most severe fractures:
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0036/2852/products/image_0e49864f-95a1-4414-94dd-463ea2b86aab_2000x.jpg (https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0036/2852/products/image_0e49864f-95a1-4414-94dd-463ea2b86aab_2000x.jpg)
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0036/2852/products/vintage_leather_ski_boots_2000x.jpg (https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0036/2852/products/vintage_leather_ski_boots_2000x.jpg)
No need to risk the loss of an evidence such as a mallet if anything went wrong. The ski boots and rocks from the creek were good enough to do the job.
Here we can see a ski boot (at the bottom right) which is worth any mallet: ski boot (https://dyatlovpass.com/resources/340/gallery/3S-37.jpg)
Baldaev said they they used to break the victim’s chest with a "hammer", Kersnovskaya saw the rib cage broken with a "blunt object", and in Kholyat Syakhl, it could have been done with a rock (Zolotaryov and Dubinina were found in the creek) or a foot kick. The point here is that they used to go after the rib cage, that it was done so commonly they had a special name for the practice (Pазбить фанеру: to crack the plywood) and a name telling how easy it was to crack it and how fragile it was... they did not call it "to crack the concrete" nor "to crack the steel beams"... "plywood".