Theories Discussion > Avalanche
Alleged slab slide that left no trace
Ziljoe:
I have, it's why I posted.... They also updated their information saying avalanches /slides have been recorded and they disappear quickly at that area. Their demonstration on the video is an example of concept, not actual fact.
The navigator ,Georgiy Karpushin that you use as an example also said .
"By the way, I was already struck by the fact that the tent was improperly set up, on a gradient of about 30 degrees, open to all winds and rock falls ... What made the guys do this - I can not imagine."
He suspects Rock falls? Says the gradient is about 30 degrees. Women lying next to the tent and the tent was poorly placed with the side cut open.
You just stated that he saw no sign of an avalanche and Karpushin said: " I remember we made a lot of runs over the tent. It was clearly visible that it was cut from the north."
How did Karpushin see the tent was cut from the north when it was found with snow on top and what happened to the female and other body he seen?
GlennM:
Holy cats! On the one hand the slab slip hypothesis is supported, but a girl by the tent? Could this lost clothing? A scavenging animal perhaps? It appears there are one too many females to be accounted for.
The explanation about the hikers pitching camp at elevation 880 so as to not lose hard won ground seems right. If conditions were harsh, then so does making a hasty camp, poorly set on that slope. A volunteer expedition is only going to work as hard as they want to and leadership is by the consent of the participants. As such, the leader can not be too didactic when getting cooperation to get things done. It seems that they worked well enough getting there, laying the cache and making camp. I suppose it met their immediate needs, even if the pilot was critical after the fact.
I feel the importance of getting to the bottom of the mystery is to prevent future occurrences precipitated by similar environmental conditions. If a conspiracy, then the bad boys got away with it, taking their guilt to the grave. There is no value in that.
Getting to the truth is the standard response for why the DPI endures. But, is more?
Ziljoe:
This is what is said by G Karpushin. If I remember correctly , he may have been dismissed as having a poor memory. I'm sure I read he had a hard time. But this has a strong link to the staging hypothesis.
https://dyatlovpass.com/interview-karpushin
Here is some of what he says in this interview.
February 25, the weather was just wonderful. Mountains against the background of a clear, clear sky created a calm, gracious mood. From Ivdel airport almost simultaneously in the air soared 7 aircraft. To the village of Burmantovo we flew in V formation. There, at an altitude of 300 m, were divided, as was agreed earlier. Kholat Syakhl (Mountain of the Dead), marked simply as "altitude 1079" on the pilot maps, was directly at the rate of the leading aircraft. "Approximately 25-30 km to the mountain," recalls navigator Karpushin, "we saw very clearly the tent stuck to the eastern slope of the mountain ...
"To avoid the accumulation of aircraft, I instructed the rest of the crafts to return to Ivdel.I remember we made a lot of runs over the tent. It was clearly visible that it was cut from the north. Straight by the tent, a corpse of a woman lay judging by her long hair.A little further away lay another body. It was evident that the students left the tent in panic. By the way, I was already struck by the fact that the tent was improperly set up, on a gradient of about 30 degrees, open to all winds and rock falls ... What made the guys do this - I can not imagine. I can assume that, having reached the top, they were so tired that they decided not to go down to the foot of the mountain. This mistake became fatal for them.
The pilots marked the tent position on the map and contacted Ivdel, where they received the command to return to the airfield. After a while, the helicopter Mi-4 flew to the place of the death of students with investigators on board. The landing of a group of investigators was borderline foul. The cloudiness was so great that the rotor was not visible. Landing on the mountain failed, so the helicopter passengers had to jump out of it from a height of several meters. In parallel, helicopter pilots evacuated other search groups. Then, at the end of the search, there was no more need for us, and in March the civil aviation pilots left for Sverdlovsk."
------------------------------------------------------------------
Obviously this raises more questions, how can he see hair and tell the gender of one of the bodies? There would be snow fall for the length of time that the bodies were missing and the tent was collapsed with snow on top when found. How did he see that it was cut? He says that some investigators had to jump out of the helicopter , could they have gone to the tent to interfere and look for things?
Karpushin's memory is either wrong, he's fabricating the story for attention or something completely different happened .
There are a number of contradictions on how the tent was found and when things were found.
Below,Sharavin recollects how he found the tent on the 26th of February.
-----------------------------------------------------------
Question: How dense was the snow on the tent that you had to chop it up with an ice ax? Do you agree that the two skis were not set up as the center ridgepoles of the tent?
M.Sharavin: The snow on top of the tent was really so hard that it had to be chopped off with an ice axe. And the skis were in front of the tent and were not used as ridgepoles.
Question: About the rope at the entrance - did it tie the skate of the entrance with skis or an ice axe, or tied it to another pole?
M.Sharavin: I can't say anything about a rope. I don't remember such.
(However Slobtsov Boris Efimovich statement says the following)
Sheet 298
PROTOCOL
witness testimony
Near the entrance of the tent on the snow
an ice ax was stuck, on the canvas of the tent, in the snow lay a pocket flashlight, Chinese make, which, as it was subsequently established, belonged to Dyatlov. It was strange that while there was a layer of snow let say 5-10 cm thick under the flashlight, there was no snow on top of it, and it was snowed slightly on either side. I took the flashlight first and found that it was not turned on. When I turned on it lit. I did not notice that day, but then I heard from other people involved in the search that there was a trace of urine in the snow near the tent.
In the immediate vicinity of the tent there were no footprints.
Ziljoe:
Charles,
Perhaps I am avoiding assuming the next step forward is firm , I do not wish to take that step only to find when I put my weight on it , I fall through a hole. It is like we are all in the dark , at night on top of a mountain, there is fog, we have blindfolds on and our eyes closed tightly shut . Everyone is pulling or pushing in a different direction from there own fixed view point.
When lost, sometimes it's best to pause, even retrace ones steps back to where one came off the path.
I'm not sure what you mean by making hierarchies and everything put in front of you, you call a fairy or fantasy ,yet, if you don't like the idea you close your mind and eyes. You criticised the work of the scientists for the avalanche by claiming they went to Walt Disney , their illustrations were wrong and whatever else about the research etc, yet you select quotes without the full sentence or context, make your own diagrams with 29 fractures ,add lines , angles and theories etc. But your examples are scientifically based? You haven't put anything forward to explain what happened in detail although you have supplied a possible motive for outsiders, which I appreciate.
I was looking at YouTube today and randomly it came up with those two scientist's about the avalanche, it just repeated that there has been several other reports of avalanches this year in the area by explorer's.
If I am flat, like a pancake , it is because there seems to be a counter argument for every theory. I spent six years reading almost every thread here and on other forums that I could find before I even registered on this forum.
Igor B goes a long way long way to give plausible explanations for many of the event's that occurred. It So happens , that Wolverine's exist, as do snowdrifts/caves. It also covers the dilated pupils, the reason to exit the tent, the search dog's behaviour , spots on clothing and skin reaction on one of the investigators hands. The injuries to the four in the ravine are consistent with a collapse of mass.
As for scales, hierarchies and the world of contingency, I have no idea what you mean but I believe we have all reached a plateau, you on the other hand have decided to chip away at others to elevate your position.
--- Quote from: Charles on October 25, 2022, 06:40:34 AM ---. You could hang a Bellini's painting close to a Pollock's without seeing any difference... shock1
--- End quote ---
I could hang a child's painting between a Bellini's and a Pollock's and you would refuse to look at the child's painting, say it's not art and have it thrown away....
GlennM:
Well. Is seems certain that is anyone is skipping their prescription medicines, they should get regulated soon.
On the other hand, with the wolverine theory, is the idea the animal got into the tent? Is there witness statements to support the wolverine theory?
With regard to tearing down other points of view to elevate one's own, I suppose it is natural, though small minded. Far better to bolster one's own theory with evidence. The evidence is not going to come from what is already known. None of us are going to puzzle out this tragedy by recombining thrice told reminiscences. What is needed is original research. Teddy and her team go to the mountain and dig. That is good. Other avenues of research are checking the financials of suspicious characters. This could include promotions, transfers and even deathbed confessions. Follow the money! If there is malicious behavior, someone knows and someone will tell.
The natural explanation of slab slide requires the fewest assumptions. The question is how do contemporary explorers avoid the same fate.
Navigation
[0] Message Index
[#] Next page
[*] Previous page
Go to full version