Looks like we know all the Ivanov's cases in 1959. 3 of them happened during winter time.
1) Murder of Galya Panteleeva
2) Fire in the hostel
3) Dyatlov group.
This pic of "unknown body" logically can belongs to Dyatlov incident only in 1959.
No, he was killed on May, 1959.
Did Ozhegov die in the fire?
I am trying to match the previous post with this count of Ivanov's cases in 1959.
I don't know about that picture - the clothing doesn't seem to match. In the pics in the ravine, the clothing looks to be a darker colour.
And I know the orientation of the head in the unknown corpse pic is at an angle away from us, but wouldn't we still be able to see more of a depression from the open eye socket?? Wasn't Kolevatov missing his eyesballs?
Wow! what an interesting theory. It would answer one of my questions: why keep this picture secret until now? I really don't see what in the picture could be compromising.
About this photo- yes, I see the same. The head of this body is looks like almost skull - open mouth and probably bare lower jaw (look how sharp is the chin, like only bone) , and empty eye (at least the one visible on the photo) , smashed nose or even just nose bone left without cartilages . But visible hand seems with flesh and not rotten as well as fullness of the body and legs is not one of just bones. So this is a body in the same state as ravine 4 ,but found in snow and when 1st five are found.
I was always thinking that ravine 4 are found in mutilated almost bare skulla state in February and were hidden under deep snow with the purpose to be found later and thus to explain their body states as natural decay. So in my theory this really could be Kolevatov found in February or unknown person not from the group with mutilated head and they just got rid off his body,because it was not needed for the official investigation to ne found. Then they cover the other badly damaged ones under the snow.
Wow! what an interesting theory. It would answer one of my questions: why keep this picture secret until now? I really don't see what in the picture could be compromising.
About this photo- yes, I see the same. The head of this body is looks like almost skull - open mouth and probably bare lower jaw (look how sharp is the chin, like only bone) , and empty eye (at least the one visible on the photo) , smashed nose or even just nose bone left without cartilages . But visible hand seems with flesh and not rotten as well as fullness of the body and legs is not one of just bones. So this is a body in the same state as ravine 4 ,but found in snow and when 1st five are found.
I was always thinking that ravine 4 are found in mutilated almost bare skulla state in February and were hidden under deep snow with the purpose to be found later and thus to explain their body states as natural decay. So in my theory this really could be Kolevatov found in February or unknown person not from the group with mutilated head and they just got rid off his body,because it was not needed for the official investigation to ne found. Then they cover the other badly damaged ones under the snow.
"Zolotaryov said to his students in Lermonotovo that he is going on a trek in Northern Urals after which all the world will hear about him."
Because he would have photographed the lights?
They planned to camp up there from the outset.
Hi everyone,
This will be my first topic here, because I still don't see any serious discussion going about the newly revealed unknown body.
So one user here in the forum suggested that this is Kolevatov and as I looked into details on big screen I think he could be right. Here are my photo comparisions and what I found out, also what is my theory about the whole case regarding ravine 4.
(https://i.ibb.co/TkWg46L/Untitled-1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/t4LJqgX)
So what do you thing about the possibility of this body being Kolevatov?
And what do you think about this theory:
I have always questioned the state of decay of ravine 4 . Spent a lot of hours researching through internet about body decomposition in cold water, in cold climate, in normal climate,,, watched about body ferms, avalnche victims, hypothermia vicitms, also how the dead bodies on Everest look like . And nowhere I found proof that for just 10-20 days in running COLD water a body could be so decomposed and not the whle body but ONLY the head. Pay attention on the gruesome photos of Luda and Zolotaryov.s post mortem photos - their bodies have suffered only maceration of the skin, nowhere exposed bones, even fingers have flesh on them.... But the heads???? ALmost bare skulls .... Also I read that eyeballs are actually very hard to decompose, they just shrink or go deeper into eye sockets , but not disappear first from the head. So I have always thinking that the ravine 4 were in the sae mutilated state BEFORE freezing. And they were hidden in the ravine under meters of snow on purpose - to avoid their finding by the searchers and then after snow thaws to explain their state with natural decay and close the case.
Is this body could be proved to be Kolevatov or even a strager with suck badly damaged head found obviously in February this will prove that ravine 4 head injuries are not natural decay and that they were hidden there . Also I think now after assuming this possibility , that the secret behind Dyatlov case is such an important mind shaking thing that even today 60 years after people who know something are threatened to be silent and are afraid to talk or show evidences. For example this body was scrathed from the photos not by authorities but from the people from Dyatlov foundation themselves :O What could be the reason for them doing this ? Aren't they the ones who want the truth to be exposed ? DOes something/someone scared them so much that they scratched it because they had no other options? I will admit that after long time of supporting the murder by humans theory, now with thinking about that damaged heads with no eyes , with all my logical and down to earth thinking, I am really starting to believe that Dyatlov group had suffered from unknown to humanity weapon or if human weapon so powerful and secret that if the world knows about its exsistance terrible things could happen with the use of it . I know I am going into fantasies but that is pure logic ,,,, and all other theories about human murder and natural causes have flaws .... So after rejecting all the possibilities, what's left, no matter how unprobable it is , is the truth - as Sherlock said :)
Oh one more very important question - on two photos is clearly visible that Kolevatov has no eyeballs too , but in the authopsy report is written that his eyeballs are present and only eyebrows are missing. What do you think ?
(https://i.ibb.co/DgXH2DR/Kolevatov-Zolotaryov-Thibeaux-Brignolle-post-mortem-2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/KzZpvjr)
"Zolotaryov said to his students in Lermonotovo that he is going on a trek in Northern Urals after which all the world will hear about him."
Because he would have photographed the lights?
They planned to camp up there from the outset.
Where does it state that Zolotaryov said those words ?
I can add more about the Dyatlov Foundation behavior. You need to know the old generation Soviet Union type of psyche. They need to be respected and taken seriously, they play their part, Kuntsevitch goes every winter to Dyatlov Pass, who else can say that?
But then they are stuck to the rocket theory, annual conferences and playing songs about the hiking in the mountains.
There is no explanation why they do this or that. There is no straight line of politics. They want to show that they are in a possession of a photo that we can't see. They will show it when they see fit. When there are no other news. It is all PR. The illustration of their psyche are all these portraits of the dead hikers which I can't bear to look at, they are so unnatural. Who can be taken seriously reading poetry and singing songs surrounded by naive portraits of Dyatlov group? Look at this, do you think these people thought it through when they showed a scratched photo?
(https://i.ibb.co/6HLfR06/Foundation.jpg)
https://youtu.be/sHxJZg0omH4?t=2025
This belongs here, no need for new topic. This whole topic is about the new body. I changed the subject to "Whose body is this?". Your's is kind of long but you can keep using it.
About the photograph being scratched by Dyatlov Foundation
(https://i.ibb.co/cFhv39X/Hanlons-razor.jpg)
If they want to hide the photo, why would they even publish it? They scratched the digital scan only, you can see that they showed it to the prosecutors so people don't speculate about this body, exactly what we do right here. They showed it so the prosecutors can dig into other cases Ivanov had to see if there were any other groups dead in the mountain, which will explain the testimony of the senile nurse from Ivdel (https://dyatlovpass.com/interview-solter?rbid=18461). Because she says things that are impossible, she washed the bodies, she did it at night, none of this is true. Autopsies were performed in daylight starting with undressing the corpses.
I disagree that if the unknown body is Kolevatov they could have hidden him together with the other three and in the course of the two months Kolevatov "embraces" Zolotaryov the way they were found. The unknown body is obviously frozen, you can't stage his hands. So you think somebody killed them, photographed them, hid them, kept the photos and gave them to Kuntsevitch to scratch out?
In this scenario at what point did they put Dubinina's hat and coat on Zolotaryov? Why redress the corpses before hiding them?Luda's hat and coat on Tibo, not Zolotarev. Ivanov made mistakes.
In this scenario at what point did they put Dubinina's hat and coat on Zolotaryov? Why redress the corpses before hiding them?
About the Dyatlov Foundation, I don't mean disrespect. We have a proverb in Bulgarian that translates to - Who sings evil does not think, or something like that, but I mean that you should think of malicious intends.
In this scenario at what point did they put Dubinina's hat and coat on Zolotaryov? Why redress the corpses before hiding them?Luda's hat and coat on Tibo, not Zolotarev. Ivanov made mistakes.
Hello,
What are your theory's on the new body being publicized to the Dyatlov Group Foundation given by relatives of Ivanov?
- Could this picture belong to another case investigated by Ivanov? What other cases did Ivanov have during 1958 - 1959 that could be related to a dead person being found in snow environment?
- Speculation being made that it is actually the body of Aleksander Kolevatov? If this is the case then this will mean that the body was not firstly discovered alongisde Zolotaryov, but perhaps with the first discovery in February. This will also mean that the body allegedly did not undergo the decomposition under thawing spring but instead the strange injuries e.g. missing eye? happened before the discovery of Rav. 4 in May. What similiarties do you see with the body (2019) and that of Aleksander Kolevatov?
Hello,
What are your theory's on the new body being publicized to the Dyatlov Group Foundation given by relatives of Ivanov?
- Could this picture belong to another case investigated by Ivanov? What other cases did Ivanov have during 1958 - 1959 that could be related to a dead person being found in snow environment?
- Speculation being made that it is actually the body of Aleksander Kolevatov? If this is the case then this will mean that the body was not firstly discovered alongisde Zolotaryov, but perhaps with the first discovery in February. This will also mean that the body allegedly did not undergo the decomposition under thawing spring but instead the strange injuries e.g. missing eye? happened before the discovery of Rav. 4 in May. What similiarties do you see with the body (2019) and that of Aleksander Kolevatov?
you can see my photos comparison here in this thread above your post and see for yourself what do you think of the similarities with Kolevatov - In my opinion the probality is high. And I am thinking exactly the same,,, injuries are not decomposition, but were like this in February . That's why the ravine 4 were hidden in the ravine .
Hello,
What are your theory's on the new body being publicized to the Dyatlov Group Foundation given by relatives of Ivanov?
- Could this picture belong to another case investigated by Ivanov? What other cases did Ivanov have during 1958 - 1959 that could be related to a dead person being found in snow environment?
- Speculation being made that it is actually the body of Aleksander Kolevatov? If this is the case then this will mean that the body was not firstly discovered alongisde Zolotaryov, but perhaps with the first discovery in February. This will also mean that the body allegedly did not undergo the decomposition under thawing spring but instead the strange injuries e.g. missing eye? happened before the discovery of Rav. 4 in May. What similiarties do you see with the body (2019) and that of Aleksander Kolevatov?
you can see my photos comparison here in this thread above your post and see for yourself what do you think of the similarities with Kolevatov - In my opinion the probality is high. And I am thinking exactly the same,,, injuries are not decomposition, but were like this in February . That's why the ravine 4 were hidden in the ravine .
"Zolotaryov said to his students in Lermonotovo that he is going on a trek in Northern Urals after which all the world will hear about him."
Because he would have photographed the lights?
They planned to camp up there from the outset.
Ivanov made mistakes
I don't see any connection of the 'new' body to the DP group. This is obviously a victim in another case Ivanov had.QuoteIvanov made mistakes
I have been saying he was incompetent for years.
Heck, it could have been from a case years after..... Most of Russia is a frozen tundra most of the year..
The 'environment' looks the same? All I see is a grainy black/white photo of a body laying on...... snow.
If a body laying in snow can be attributed to the DP case on that basis alone...... oh boy. nose1
Heck, this could have been from a different investigators case and Ivanov was simply interested or trying to assist in said case.
There are 400+ possibilities
Well, we can presume it's not one of Ivanov's other cases from 1959 for reasons already mentioned. As for its being from an unrelated case, I'm not so sure. First of all, it's from someone from the same demographic as the Dyatlov group: young, physically fit European male not properly dressed for the elements and wearing some of the same under-clothing the others wore: what's described in the coroner's report as a "cowboy shirt." It's also someone who looks to have frozen to death but isn't in the usual position of those who die of hypothermia, the fetal position. Instead the person looks like his hands have been bound and perhaps his feet. Then it is someone whose upper face has been carved out around the sockets, his nose removed, and the jaw broken while the body remains intact.
I'm from a part of the world that has a similar climate to the Urals. Number of people who die like this during the winter every year: 0. This past year, because of the polar vortex, there was one young man who got locked out of his apartment and wasn't properly dressed, just like this unknown person. But he was found in a fetal position. We DO see young men who are drunk, leave a bar, go down to the water to urinate, and then fall in and freeze. I doubt people in Russia went around like they were dressed for Miami in the winter.
That being said, I agree we need a pathologist to weigh in on the usual postions of those who freeze to death. And the issue that continues to trouble me about identifying this body as Alex Z's is that he is wearing a coat in the ravine (it's the one that had radioactivity on it). I am pretty sure that is just a Country and Western shirt in the photo even though it appears lighter because of the snow. I can't see the collar and opening of a coat here. Can anyone else see a second garment? And it is pretty difficult to re-dress a corpse. Plus it begs the question of why someone would do that.
I have been reshearching about body decomposition in different environments and also looking at post mortem photos ,and I may say that I can rule out natural decay. If it was natural hands and other parts would be stripped to bone too. And also look at Zolotaryav post mortem picture. I don't want to post it here it is too gruesome. There it is visible how his face tissues are almost intact and are the phase of maceration,but baaam two black holes for eyes. I have watched stages of decay from body farms ,and no there is no such thing of differently decayed parts. Whole body decomposes in same rate. With predators it is not just eyes and not whole eyes,birds eat from eyes but don't leave such complete big wholes.
And because there is absolutely nothing that could logically explain the missing eyes and deformes heads except for aliens , I tried to think what is the thing on Earth that makes faces deformed and like being burned - it is acid. And yes, acid us a well known mean of murder,punishing the victims,easy to be taken with you, it was freely diatributed in pharmacies not long ago. So for sure in late 50s there were no restrictions on selling it, like the codein pills of Kolevatov were free to buy without prescription.
So if the ravine injuries are pre mortem and not a decay, the only thing that could make them is acid spilled on their faces. The others were beaten and died of hypothermia, but ravine 4 made a den and were well dressed. But acid can't explain their chest injuries and Nikolai's skull..... So we are back at aliens with unknown weapon 😁😁😁
I have been reshearching about body decomposition in different environments and also looking at post mortem photos ,and I may say that I can rule out natural decay. If it was natural hands and other parts would be stripped to bone too. And also look at Zolotaryav post mortem picture. I don't want to post it here it is too gruesome. There it is visible how his face tissues are almost intact and are the phase of maceration,but baaam two black holes for eyes. I have watched stages of decay from body farms ,and no there is no such thing of differently decayed parts. Whole body decomposes in same rate. With predators it is not just eyes and not whole eyes,birds eat from eyes but don't leave such complete big wholes.
And because there is absolutely nothing that could logically explain the missing eyes and deformes heads except for aliens , I tried to think what is the thing on Earth that makes faces deformed and like being burned - it is acid. And yes, acid us a well known mean of murder,punishing the victims,easy to be taken with you, it was freely diatributed in pharmacies not long ago. So for sure in late 50s there were no restrictions on selling it, like the codein pills of Kolevatov were free to buy without prescription.
So if the ravine injuries are pre mortem and not a decay, the only thing that could make them is acid spilled on their faces. The others were beaten and died of hypothermia, but ravine 4 made a den and were well dressed. But acid can't explain their chest injuries and Nikolai's skull..... So we are back at aliens with unknown weapon 😁😁😁
Well, we can presume it's not one of Ivanov's other cases from 1959 for reasons already mentioned. As for its being from an unrelated case, I'm not so sure. First of all, it's from someone from the same demographic as the Dyatlov group: young, physically fit European male not properly dressed for the elements and wearing some of the same under-clothing the others wore: what's described in the coroner's report as a "cowboy shirt." It's also someone who looks to have frozen to death but isn't in the usual position of those who die of hypothermia, the fetal position. Instead the person looks like his hands have been bound and perhaps his feet. Then it is someone whose upper face has been carved out around the sockets, his nose removed, and the jaw broken while the body remains intact.
I'm from a part of the world that has a similar climate to the Urals. Number of people who die like this during the winter every year: 0. This past year, because of the polar vortex, there was one young man who got locked out of his apartment and wasn't properly dressed, just like this unknown person. But he was found in a fetal position. We DO see young men who are drunk, leave a bar, go down to the water to urinate, and then fall in and freeze. I doubt people in Russia went around like they were dressed for Miami in the winter.
That being said, I agree we need a pathologist to weigh in on the usual postions of those who freeze to death. And the issue that continues to trouble me about identifying this body as Alex Z's is that he is wearing a coat in the ravine (it's the one that had radioactivity on it). I am pretty sure that is just a Country and Western shirt in the photo even though it appears lighter because of the snow. I can't see the collar and opening of a coat here. Can anyone else see a second garment? And it is pretty difficult to re-dress a corpse. Plus it begs the question of why someone would do that.
That's what I am trying to say according to plain logic. What are the odds of finding an undressed body in stretched position and no eyes in another case? Damn Russians going naked in the forest and fighting with star wars swords piercing through their eyes.. twitch7
About Kolevatov , yes he has a jacket in the ravine. That is the only detail that does not match. Unzipped jacket is easy to be put on stiff corpse as the hands are not bent so much. But again even if this is not Kolevatov ,yes, this body definetely has all the signs of being met by the same death as Dyatlov group ,which means this person has been with the group, or as I said must be common in Russia people to die in forests undressed with no eyes .... By the way Dyatlov has died in the same position like his hands and legs were tied. What do you think of murder by humans, who used acid on last 4 spilled on their faces?
I have been reshearching about body decomposition in different environments and also looking at post mortem photos ,and I may say that I can rule out natural decay. If it was natural hands and other parts would be stripped to bone too. And also look at Zolotaryav post mortem picture. I don't want to post it here it is too gruesome. There it is visible how his face tissues are almost intact and are the phase of maceration,but baaam two black holes for eyes. I have watched stages of decay from body farms ,and no there is no such thing of differently decayed parts. Whole body decomposes in same rate. With predators it is not just eyes and not whole eyes,birds eat from eyes but don't leave such complete big wholes.
And because there is absolutely nothing that could logically explain the missing eyes and deformes heads except for aliens , I tried to think what is the thing on Earth that makes faces deformed and like being burned - it is acid. And yes, acid us a well known mean of murder,punishing the victims,easy to be taken with you, it was freely diatributed in pharmacies not long ago. So for sure in late 50s there were no restrictions on selling it, like the codein pills of Kolevatov were free to buy without prescription.
So if the ravine injuries are pre mortem and not a decay, the only thing that could make them is acid spilled on their faces. The others were beaten and died of hypothermia, but ravine 4 made a den and were well dressed. But acid can't explain their chest injuries and Nikolai's skull..... So we are back at aliens with unknown weapon 😁😁😁
I have been reshearching about body decomposition in different environments and also looking at post mortem photos ,and I may say that I can rule out natural decay. If it was natural hands and other parts would be stripped to bone too. And also look at Zolotaryav post mortem picture. I don't want to post it here it is too gruesome. There it is visible how his face tissues are almost intact and are the phase of maceration,but baaam two black holes for eyes. I have watched stages of decay from body farms ,and no there is no such thing of differently decayed parts. Whole body decomposes in same rate. With predators it is not just eyes and not whole eyes,birds eat from eyes but don't leave such complete big wholes.
And because there is absolutely nothing that could logically explain the missing eyes and deformes heads except for aliens , I tried to think what is the thing on Earth that makes faces deformed and like being burned - it is acid. And yes, acid us a well known mean of murder,punishing the victims,easy to be taken with you, it was freely diatributed in pharmacies not long ago. So for sure in late 50s there were no restrictions on selling it, like the codein pills of Kolevatov were free to buy without prescription.
So if the ravine injuries are pre mortem and not a decay, the only thing that could make them is acid spilled on their faces. The others were beaten and died of hypothermia, but ravine 4 made a den and were well dressed. But acid can't explain their chest injuries and Nikolai's skull..... So we are back at aliens with unknown weapon 😁😁😁
The whole idea of Alien's attacking the Dyatlov Group is as ridiculous as a 10ft hairy giant murdering 9 people. The hikers were suggested to be alive several hours after fleeing their tent.
And it is very possible that a combination of predators and live bacteria after thawing spring (thawing can accelerate the decomposition process quite significantly) could have caused the missing eyes.
In this scenario at what point did they put Dubinina's hat and coat on Zolotaryov? Why redress the corpses before hiding them?
About the Dyatlov Foundation, I don't mean disrespect.
We have a proverb in Bulgarian that translates to - Who sings evil does not think, or something like that, but I mean that you should think of malicious intends.
I have been reshearching about body decomposition in different environments and also looking at post mortem photos ,and I may say that I can rule out natural decay. If it was natural hands and other parts would be stripped to bone too. And also look at Zolotaryav post mortem picture. I don't want to post it here it is too gruesome. There it is visible how his face tissues are almost intact and are the phase of maceration,but baaam two black holes for eyes. I have watched stages of decay from body farms ,and no there is no such thing of differently decayed parts. Whole body decomposes in same rate. With predators it is not just eyes and not whole eyes,birds eat from eyes but don't leave such complete big wholes.
And because there is absolutely nothing that could logically explain the missing eyes and deformes heads except for aliens , I tried to think what is the thing on Earth that makes faces deformed and like being burned - it is acid. And yes, acid us a well known mean of murder,punishing the victims,easy to be taken with you, it was freely diatributed in pharmacies not long ago. So for sure in late 50s there were no restrictions on selling it, like the codein pills of Kolevatov were free to buy without prescription.
So if the ravine injuries are pre mortem and not a decay, the only thing that could make them is acid spilled on their faces. The others were beaten and died of hypothermia, but ravine 4 made a den and were well dressed. But acid can't explain their chest injuries and Nikolai's skull..... So we are back at aliens with unknown weapon 😁😁😁
The whole idea of Alien's attacking the Dyatlov Group is as ridiculous as a 10ft hairy giant murdering 9 people. The hikers were suggested to be alive several hours after fleeing their tent.
And it is very possible that a combination of predators and live bacteria after thawing spring (thawing can accelerate the decomposition process quite significantly) could have caused the missing eyes.