Theories Discussion > General Discussion
The Instinct of Self Preservation
Игорь Б.:
Самые лучшие дрова для костра:
--- Quote ---Кедр - это настоящий король для костра. Сухие сучья этого дерева настоящая находка для путника. костер с помощью кедровых дров можно развести даже в самую сырую погоду. Костер будет давать ровное, красивое пламя и отличный жар. Древесина кедра не дымит и не стреляет.
Идеальными дровами для костра будут кедровые. Если вы хоть раз проведете ночевку у костра на кедровых дровах, никогда не забудете этой превосходной ночевки. В дальнейшем больше никогда не захотите выбрать другие дрова для костра.
--- End quote ---
https://dzen.ru/media/id/604b1202fa7bf6638f2a9bdc/samye-luchshie-drova-dlia-kostra-moi-opyt-teper-jgu-koster-tolko-iz-etoi-drevesiny-605040476c861f01074efab0
Почему на кедре были обломаны сучья на большой высоте?
http://1723.ru/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=5133&view=findpost&p=77115
Игорь Б.:
--- Quote from: Manti on September 20, 2022, 08:57:59 PM ---^Skepticism of the slab avalanche.
--- End quote ---
Всего лишь отвал от грейдера при -10°C:
(смотреть со звуком)
Всего лишь падение снега с крыши:
http://1723.ru/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=5133&view=findpost&p=107249
Ziljoe:
Igor b writes:
The best firewood for a fire:
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Cedar is the real king for a campfire. The dry branches of this tree are a real find for the traveler. a fire with the help of cedar firewood can be made even in the wettest weather. The fire will give an even, beautiful flame and excellent heat. Cedar wood does not smoke or shoot.
Ideal firewood for a fire would be cedar. If you ever spend the night by the fire on cedar wood, you will never forget this excellent overnight stay. In the future, you will never again want to choose other wood for a fire.
From Igor b's link , leads to this:
Igor b writes:
Why did the branches of the cedar be broken off at high altitude? Because the best fuel for a fire was dry cedar branches. From the site inspection report:
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near the cedar, dry branches are broken off in 2 - 2.5 meters. The branches are broken off on the cedar itself.
Igor b writes:
The Dyatlovites did not use living wood and deadwood in the fire for a well-known reason:
http://1723.ru/forums/index.php?s=&sho...ost&p=76174
And dry branches on cedars can be not only below, but also above , at high altitude, where the cold wind in winter is especially strong. Branches and die from withering wind from the windward side.
At the Dyatlov cedar, the windward (western) side coincidentally faced the tent.
Igor b writes:
Why didn't the Dyatlovites use deadwood in the fire?
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Faced such a problem. Since the weather this winter jumped from plus to minus, with wet snow, all the firewood was completely saturated with ice. We had to cut down healthy trees, but having cut down we were very surprised that even their core was frosted through. As a result, we could not melt the stove in the tent, we drowned with small branches trying to dry the large ones (they did not catch fire).
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My son and I were in a similar situation.
There was a cyclone, everything got wet, and then it froze. Firewood is raw.
They lit only logs of logs.
But the fire still burned terribly.
Firewood, warming up on a fire, began to fill it with a melted crust of ice.
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I myself did not expect such a situation. A full forest of firewood, dry land - the sea, but he does not burn a dog.
Brushwood is generally a stupid thing. Ice stick.
And in this situation, the most difficult thing is not making a fire, but maintaining the flame and the necessary heat.http://nepropadu.ru/blog/guestroom/10714.html
At the Dyatlov Pass in December 2015:
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With firewood, as they wrote in the reports, everything is bad (they do not burn).Reasonable efforts of the fire did not work, I had to cook on a burner.
At the very first night in a tent, I was convinced that firewood is often a problem. You find a dryer, saw / prick, burn chips, then put them in a larger one, then wave, even larger ... While you wave, it burns perfectly. Stopped waving - does not burn. Dry, coniferous species - and does not burn. Well, there are some places like that.
Bring firewood, chop it, dig at least some kind of fire pit, make sure that firewood is not firewood, look for alternative coniferous branches (which burn perfectly, but burn out very quickly), dance with a tambourine around the hearth - all this is very long.
Bonfires were not every day, because. they took a lot of time (pit + firewood + dances with a tambourine, so that non-burning firewood somehow burned). Once, during the late setting of the camp and long exercises with a fire, I fought back only at 05 in the morning.https://www.risk.ru/blog/207346?http://www.....ru/blog/207346
From the diary of the Dyatlov group dated January 31, 1959:
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Firewood is scarce. Sickly raw spruce.
Igor b writes:
Even if the Christmas trees were damp, then what can we say about the deadwood birch. From the autumn rains, he absorbed water and, lying on the ground, did not dry out by winter. Warming on the eve of the incident before the arrival of the cold front only added to the dampness.
Thus, the Dyatlovites had no other fuel for the fire, except for dry, dead cedar branches, most of which were located on the windward western side, i.e. from the side coincidentally facing the tent.
It was impossible to warm up with nine half-dressed people around a fire made of branches, and even divorced for known reasons in a strong wind. Branches quickly burn out and people who are forced to constantly extract such fuel for a fire are supercooled more than they warm up.
Basically,Igor b is saying, that the dead wood on the ground would be damp and frozen , will not burn well and takes work to do so if at all. However the ceder tree would be a good source for dry wood as the wind will have help dry out the branches that faced the slope. Sounds logical to me.....
GlennM:
I never considered the snow den as their first stop. Fascinating! They dig in, there is a collapse, some retreat to the cedar, that doesn't really work, so the last 3 make for the tent. It turns out badly. What rotten luck!
Nothing in this scenario leads me to infer they were fleeing from human attackers. Too, if it was an animal, I would be making my way back to camp holding a flaming torch, wouldn`t you?
I applaud the footprint photos. It shows how degraded these impressions in the snow can get. Pity that Mansi trackers did not offer an opinion of the prints from the tent. We know something made impressions in the snow. Just who in their right mind would do it in socks?
Ziljoe:
--- Quote from: GlennM on September 21, 2022, 03:30:23 PM ---I never considered the snow den as their first stop. Fascinating! They dig in, there is a collapse, some retreat to the cedar, that doesn't really work, so the last 3 make for the tent. It turns out badly. What rotten luck!
Nothing in this scenario leads me to infer they were fleeing from human attackers. Too, if it was an animal, I would be making my way back to camp holding a flaming torch, wouldn`t you?
I applaud the footprint photos. It shows how degraded these impressions in the snow can get. Pity that Mansi trackers did not offer an opinion of the prints from the tent. We know something made impressions in the snow. Just who in their right mind would do it in socks?
--- End quote ---
Many fatalities are a sequence of small errors . Chang one variable and the outcome would be different.
I don't know how they could make a flaming torch given the conditions and environment and the hey couldn't keep a fire going. Who knows...
As for the foot prints, the Mansi were involved, at least at the ravine around the den. Many witnessed the foot prints of feet in socks , obviously difficult to say from the photos?
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