Theories Discussion > KGB / Radiation / Military involvement
Reasons against a low yield nuclear test
Puchiko:
--- Quote from: Star man on March 04, 2019, 08:42:36 AM ---Also the injuries are not consistent with a shock wave blast. Would expect more significant secondary injuries and also evidence of damage to surrounding areas and trees. Injuries are more consistent with a fall. But why and how would more than one person succumb to the same type of fall? Unless their cognitive processes were affected?
--- End quote ---
Disclaimer: I don't have a complex theory, but I am leaning towards some sort of military involvement.
I think that the bomb was what scared them from the tent, but wasn't necessarily responsible for all of the injuries. Group hears bombs detonating in the distance, planes flying overhead. They leave the tent in a shell shocked panic, perhaps not fully rational. Maybe the smoke, debris and fog from the bomb makes it to the pass and impairs their vision, maybe not. They head for the forest to hide from planes (or maybe just run like a frightened animal away from the noise). A toxic smog makes it over the mountain, the guys later found with edemas on their lungs start suffocating, the others try to climb up the cedar but fall, causing some weird injuries. They crawl to the ravine seeking shelter from the elements. Zina and Igor try to make it to the tent (maybe they thought - rightly or wrongly that the danger had passed), but they die of exposure. Maybe there's a second explosion at some point and the shockwave causes some more weird injuries - but not necessarily.
What I'm trying to say is that the bomb need not have necessarily dropped directly on the site: in fact, the lack of damage to surroundings suggests it did not. Once they were confused and far from the tent, death was inevitable.
Ivanov later claimed some young pine trees at the edge of the forest had burn marks, this is often used to support "alien death ray" theories. It could also be some sign of a thermobaric bomb. But since it isn't documented at all, we can't draw conclusions from it.
Star man:
--- Quote from: Puchiko on March 04, 2019, 03:22:02 PM ---
--- Quote from: Star man on March 04, 2019, 08:42:36 AM ---Also the injuries are not consistent with a shock wave blast. Would expect more significant secondary injuries and also evidence of damage to surrounding areas and trees. Injuries are more consistent with a fall. But why and how would more than one person succumb to the same type of fall? Unless their cognitive processes were affected?
--- End quote ---
Disclaimer: I don't have a complex theory, but I am leaning towards some sort of military involvement.
I think that the bomb was what scared them from the tent, but wasn't necessarily responsible for all of the injuries. Group hears bombs detonating in the distance, planes flying overhead. They leave the tent in a shell shocked panic, perhaps not fully rational. Maybe the smoke, debris and fog from the bomb makes it to the pass and impairs their vision, maybe not. They head for the forest to hide from planes (or maybe just run like a frightened animal away from the noise). A toxic smog makes it over the mountain, the guys later found with edemas on their lungs start suffocating, the others try to climb up the cedar but fall, causing some weird injuries. They crawl to the ravine seeking shelter from the elements. Zina and Igor try to make it to the tent (maybe they thought - rightly or wrongly that the danger had passed), but they die of exposure. Maybe there's a second explosion at some point and the shockwave causes some more weird injuries - but not necessarily.
What I'm trying to say is that the bomb need not have necessarily dropped directly on the site: in fact, the lack of damage to surroundings suggests it did not. Once they were confused and far from the tent, death was inevitable.
Ivanov later claimed some young pine trees at the edge of the forest had burn marks, this is often used to support "alien death ray" theories. It could also be some sign of a thermobaric bomb. But since it isn't documented at all, we can't draw conclusions from it.
--- End quote ---
Yes. This was also my conclusion in my theory of the low yield tactical nuke. A nuke detonated 1-2km up wind, results In a toxic cloud of fallout gases. Also radioactive. The explosion would not have caused any significant injuries at the tent. The toxic gas cloud coupled with what they had seen and heard in terms of the explosion forces them to get away from the area. The toxic cloud affected their breathing and leads to hypoxia and loss of consciousness, which in turn led to some of the significant injuries. It may have been some other kind of device as Ryan has posted, but I don't think the injuries were a direct result of the explosion.
One thing that is becoming clearer though is that there was radioactive contamination of the hikers and possibly the area as a whole.
sarapuk:
--- Quote from: Puchiko on March 04, 2019, 03:22:02 PM ---
--- Quote from: Star man on March 04, 2019, 08:42:36 AM ---Also the injuries are not consistent with a shock wave blast. Would expect more significant secondary injuries and also evidence of damage to surrounding areas and trees. Injuries are more consistent with a fall. But why and how would more than one person succumb to the same type of fall? Unless their cognitive processes were affected?
--- End quote ---
Disclaimer: I don't have a complex theory, but I am leaning towards some sort of military involvement.
I think that the bomb was what scared them from the tent, but wasn't necessarily responsible for all of the injuries. Group hears bombs detonating in the distance, planes flying overhead. They leave the tent in a shell shocked panic, perhaps not fully rational. Maybe the smoke, debris and fog from the bomb makes it to the pass and impairs their vision, maybe not. They head for the forest to hide from planes (or maybe just run like a frightened animal away from the noise). A toxic smog makes it over the mountain, the guys later found with edemas on their lungs start suffocating, the others try to climb up the cedar but fall, causing some weird injuries. They crawl to the ravine seeking shelter from the elements. Zina and Igor try to make it to the tent (maybe they thought - rightly or wrongly that the danger had passed), but they die of exposure. Maybe there's a second explosion at some point and the shockwave causes some more weird injuries - but not necessarily.
What I'm trying to say is that the bomb need not have necessarily dropped directly on the site: in fact, the lack of damage to surroundings suggests it did not. Once they were confused and far from the tent, death was inevitable.
Ivanov later claimed some young pine trees at the edge of the forest had burn marks, this is often used to support "alien death ray" theories. It could also be some sign of a thermobaric bomb. But since it isn't documented at all, we can't draw conclusions from it.
--- End quote ---
The Nuclear Weapon theory has been discussed in other parts of the Forum. There is absolutely nothing that points to any kind of Nuclear Explosion that caused or led to the demise of the Dyatlov Group. In this Post you are suggesting that explosions some distance away scared them out of their Tent. Is that really feasible. I dont think so. Experienced out doors people are not going to abandon their refuge and put their lives at risk. Its been said many times and it appears to need repeating. They are not going to leave the Tent without proper clothing and equipment and walk a mile to their certain DEATH of exposure to the elements because they heard some explosions in the distance.
Star man:
--- Quote from: sarapuk on March 04, 2019, 04:33:00 PM ---
--- Quote from: Puchiko on March 04, 2019, 03:22:02 PM ---
--- Quote from: Star man on March 04, 2019, 08:42:36 AM ---Also the injuries are not consistent with a shock wave blast. Would expect more significant secondary injuries and also evidence of damage to surrounding areas and trees. Injuries are more consistent with a fall. But why and how would more than one person succumb to the same type of fall? Unless their cognitive processes were affected?
--- End quote ---
Disclaimer: I don't have a complex theory, but I am leaning towards some sort of military involvement.
I think that the bomb was what scared them from the tent, but wasn't necessarily responsible for all of the injuries. Group hears bombs detonating in the distance, planes flying overhead. They leave the tent in a shell shocked panic, perhaps not fully rational. Maybe the smoke, debris and fog from the bomb makes it to the pass and impairs their vision, maybe not. They head for the forest to hide from planes (or maybe just run like a frightened animal away from the noise). A toxic smog makes it over the mountain, the guys later found with edemas on their lungs start suffocating, the others try to climb up the cedar but fall, causing some weird injuries. They crawl to the ravine seeking shelter from the elements. Zina and Igor try to make it to the tent (maybe they thought - rightly or wrongly that the danger had passed), but they die of exposure. Maybe there's a second explosion at some point and the shockwave causes some more weird injuries - but not necessarily.
What I'm trying to say is that the bomb need not have necessarily dropped directly on the site: in fact, the lack of damage to surroundings suggests it did not. Once they were confused and far from the tent, death was inevitable.
Ivanov later claimed some young pine trees at the edge of the forest had burn marks, this is often used to support "alien death ray" theories. It could also be some sign of a thermobaric bomb. But since it isn't documented at all, we can't draw conclusions from it.
--- End quote ---
The Nuclear Weapon theory has been discussed in other parts of the Forum. There is absolutely nothing that points to any kind of Nuclear Explosion that caused or led to the demise of the Dyatlov Group. In this Post you are suggesting that explosions some distance away scared them out of their Tent. Is that really feasible. I dont think so. Experienced out doors people are not going to abandon their refuge and put their lives at risk. Its been said many times and it appears to need repeating. They are not going to leave the Tent without proper clothing and equipment and walk a mile to their certain DEATH of exposure to the elements because they heard some explosions in the distance.
--- End quote ---
There is evidence that points toward some kind of nuclear device - the radioactive contamination + the fact they brought Geiger counters when investigations were ongoing. There would be no physical evidence on the north east slope even if a device had exploded 1 to 2 km away. Probably not even much around the point of detonation.
In the nuke theory I have presented I suggest that it is the fallout gases that drives the group away from the tent.
I would only give my own theory 5:1 odds. However there is clear evidence of radioactive contamination and that IMO can’t be ignored or brushed off.
sarapuk:
--- Quote from: Star man on March 04, 2019, 11:42:31 PM ---
--- Quote from: sarapuk on March 04, 2019, 04:33:00 PM ---
--- Quote from: Puchiko on March 04, 2019, 03:22:02 PM ---
--- Quote from: Star man on March 04, 2019, 08:42:36 AM ---Also the injuries are not consistent with a shock wave blast. Would expect more significant secondary injuries and also evidence of damage to surrounding areas and trees. Injuries are more consistent with a fall. But why and how would more than one person succumb to the same type of fall? Unless their cognitive processes were affected?
--- End quote ---
Disclaimer: I don't have a complex theory, but I am leaning towards some sort of military involvement.
I think that the bomb was what scared them from the tent, but wasn't necessarily responsible for all of the injuries. Group hears bombs detonating in the distance, planes flying overhead. They leave the tent in a shell shocked panic, perhaps not fully rational. Maybe the smoke, debris and fog from the bomb makes it to the pass and impairs their vision, maybe not. They head for the forest to hide from planes (or maybe just run like a frightened animal away from the noise). A toxic smog makes it over the mountain, the guys later found with edemas on their lungs start suffocating, the others try to climb up the cedar but fall, causing some weird injuries. They crawl to the ravine seeking shelter from the elements. Zina and Igor try to make it to the tent (maybe they thought - rightly or wrongly that the danger had passed), but they die of exposure. Maybe there's a second explosion at some point and the shockwave causes some more weird injuries - but not necessarily.
What I'm trying to say is that the bomb need not have necessarily dropped directly on the site: in fact, the lack of damage to surroundings suggests it did not. Once they were confused and far from the tent, death was inevitable.
Ivanov later claimed some young pine trees at the edge of the forest had burn marks, this is often used to support "alien death ray" theories. It could also be some sign of a thermobaric bomb. But since it isn't documented at all, we can't draw conclusions from it.
--- End quote ---
The Nuclear Weapon theory has been discussed in other parts of the Forum. There is absolutely nothing that points to any kind of Nuclear Explosion that caused or led to the demise of the Dyatlov Group. In this Post you are suggesting that explosions some distance away scared them out of their Tent. Is that really feasible. I dont think so. Experienced out doors people are not going to abandon their refuge and put their lives at risk. Its been said many times and it appears to need repeating. They are not going to leave the Tent without proper clothing and equipment and walk a mile to their certain DEATH of exposure to the elements because they heard some explosions in the distance.
--- End quote ---
There is evidence that points toward some kind of nuclear device - the radioactive contamination + the fact they brought Geiger counters when investigations were ongoing. There would be no physical evidence on the north east slope even if a device had exploded 1 to 2 km away. Probably not even much around the point of detonation.
In the nuke theory I have presented I suggest that it is the fallout gases that drives the group away from the tent.
I would only give my own theory 5:1 odds. However there is clear evidence of radioactive contamination and that IMO can’t be ignored or brushed off.
--- End quote ---
There is no real evidence that points to any particular theory. Just very vague information that may suggest this that or the other theories. We have to assume a lot in the Dyatlov Case. And assumptions as they say, can be dangerous. We assume that Lev Ivanov had a Geiger Counter that went crazy around the Tent. We assume that others involved in the search also brought in Geiger Counters. We assume that as a result of the Geiger Counters READOUTS it was decided to carry out further tests, on some of the bodies, at the Laboratories. We dont know why they only chose the Ravine 4 to carry out the tests on. As regards your theory and RADIATION FALLOUT GASES, the smell or taste affect would only be viable if a very large event had taken place, for instance as happened at CHERNOBYL. And no event of that scale happened in the area that the Dyatlov Group were hiking. And even if it had there would still have been time for them to get properly dressed and equipped.
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