Theories Discussion > Murdered

A problem with homicide theories

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ElizabethHarris:
Autopsy said she had copious amounts of blood in her lungs and stomach, in fact the stomach was filled with blood. I think it's a fair assumption that since her tongue is missing it's safe to conclude the blood came from the removal of the tongue. Even the worst bloody nose probably wouldn't drown a person in their own blood but I could be wrong.

Charles:
Hello,

--- Quote from: sarapuk on November 28, 2020, 04:35:16 PM ---There are no indications of the presence of other people in the area.
--- End quote ---
According to the diaries, there was a Mansi hunter in front of them and the Russian and Mansi workers in their back at District 41.


--- Quote from: sarapuk on November 28, 2020, 04:35:16 PM ---No footprints.
--- End quote ---
But no photo of immaculate snow with a clear and unique track of footprints descending from the tent to the forest. Or is there one ?


--- Quote from: sarapuk on November 28, 2020, 04:35:16 PM ---Nothing to really suggest that other people were involved.
--- End quote ---
The nature of the threat that made them all get out of the tent and run to the forest. If they were alone with the laws of physics, there was no reason to leave the tent in such a hurry without shoes and equipment. If they were alone with animals such as bear or wolves, why stop a the the border of the forest (and no marks of bites) ? And they had knives, ski poles and axes which were of no use against the threat (which give a reasonable chance to repel animals but not firearms). If it is neither physical, nor animal... then it is human. It's like if the threat claimed the tent and the hikers knew their only chance was to stay away but not so far from the tent in the hope that the threat would finally leave it. If it's physical, no reason to leave the tent whatsoever, if it's animal, no reason not to fight back with cold steel... so, leaving the tent without fighting back means attacker with firepower and interested with the tent... human. Maybe the attackers stayed in the tent for a while, waiting for the cold to kill the hikers, and cut the tissue when leaving to check and finish off the hikers...

Greetings

sarapuk:

--- Quote from: Charles on February 11, 2022, 02:41:37 AM ---Hello,

--- Quote from: sarapuk on November 28, 2020, 04:35:16 PM ---There are no indications of the presence of other people in the area.
--- End quote ---
According to the diaries, they had a "team" of Mansi deer hunters in front of them and the Russian and Mansi workers in their back at District 41.  [[ But no record of other people in the area where they met their demise ]]


--- Quote from: sarapuk on November 28, 2020, 04:35:16 PM ---No footprints.
--- End quote ---
But no photo of immaculate snow with a clear and unique track of footprints descending from the tent to the forest. Or is there one ?  [[ But there is a photo of tracks descending from the tent to the forest and it seems to suggest that it was only the Dyatlov Group ]]


--- Quote from: sarapuk on November 28, 2020, 04:35:16 PM ---Nothing to really suggest that other people were involved.
--- End quote ---
The nature of the threat that made them all get out of the tent and run to the forest. If they were alone with the laws of physics, there was no reason to leave the tent in such a hurry without shoes and equipment. If they were alone with animals such as bear or wolves, why stop a the the border of the forest (and no marks of bites) ? And they had knives, ski poles and axes which were of no use against the threat (which give a reasonable chance to repel animals but not firearms). If it is neither physical, nor animal... then it is human. It's like if the threat claimed the tent and the hikers knew their only chance was to stay away but not so far from the tent in the hope that the threat would finally leave it. If it's physical, no reason to leave the tent whatsoever, if it's animal, no reason not to fight back with cold steel... so, leaving the tent without fighting back means attacker with firepower and interested with the tent... human. Maybe the attackers stayed in the tent for a while, waiting for the cold to kill the hikers, and cut the tissue when leaving to check and finish off the hikers...  [[  May be other people or animals werent involved  ]]

Greetings

--- End quote ---

Charles:
Hello Sarapuk,

Couldn't understand your reply !

But there is a very decisive pattern in the injuries received by the hikers. Whatever injured them did not strike at random. The strongest blows  could have hit any part of the bodies - arms, hips, legs, feet - but they did not, all these blows were in vital areas - head (twice: Thibeaux-Brignolle and Slobodin) and chest (twice: Dubinina and Zolotaryov). Four hikers had bone fractures and all the fractures were in areas where they could threaten life.

Why would a random non human force aim at vital organs? Brain, heart and lungs? While ignoring foot and forearm ?

About the minor injuries at their hands, very few were at the palm but : "bruise with bleeding into the underlying soft tissue on the back of the right hand corresponding to the second metacarpal bone" (Doroschenko), "back of the right hand is swollen and in the middle phalanx of the fingers 4-5 cutaneous wound with hard edges and charred surface" (Krivonischenko), "metacarpophalangeal joints on the right hand had brown red bruises" (Dyatlov), "abrasion on the back of both hands in the area of metacarpal phalangeal and inter-phalangeal joints and wound with jagged edges and missing skin on the back of the right hand at the base of the third finger" (Kolmogorova), "bruises in the metacarpophalangeal joints on both hands (bruised knuckles)" (Slobodin)... When working without gloves, injuries occurs mainly at the palm, but here injuries are at the back of the hand when hand is closed forming a fist, as when fighting.

And here also there is a pattern. Thibeaux-Brignolle, Dubinina and Zolotaryov had life threatening fracture injuries in the chest-head area but no minor wounds at the back of the hands, Doroschenko, Krivonischenko, Dyatlov and Kolmogorova had minor wounds at the back of the hands but no life threatening fracture injuries in the chest-head area.

Slobodin having both life threatening fracture injuries in the chest-head area and minor wounds at the back of the hands. Kolevatov having neither life threatening fracture injuries in the chest-head area nor minor wounds at the back of the hands. But if we consider Kolevatov broken nose as "fracture injury in the chest-head area" and deformation of cartilage in the neck, he could join the list with Thibeaux-Brignolle, Dubinina and Zolotaryov.

So, we have Thibeaux-Brignolle, Dubinina, Kolevatov and Zolotaryov with serious fracture injuries in the chest-head area but no minor wounds at the back of the hands, Slobodin with both life serious fracture injuries in the chest-head area and minor wounds at the back of the hands and Doroschenko, Krivonischenko, Dyatlov and Kolmogorova with minor wounds at the back of the hands but no serious fracture injuries in the chest-head area.

Some were brutally hit and couldn't fight back, the ones who had stigmata of fist fight slowly died of hypothermia. Slobodin being at the intersection of the two sets.

So none of the 36 legs and arms (9 hikers x 4 body members) sustained any bone fracture injury: 0/36! But 4 upper bodies had bone fractures: 4/9 ! 5/9 if we include Kolevatov broken nose! The "natural force" managed to avoid the 36 body members and randomly targeted brain, heart and lungs? Who can buy that fairytale?

The statistics of injuries point at  homicide. Homicide committed by the Mansi, by the loggers, whatever, because of an attack from the outside or because of internal dissension, but homicide for sure.

Greetings

PS: You give me the opportunity to correct my statement about "indications of the presence of other people in the area": according to the diaries, there was one Mansi hunter close beyond the group (they did not write about some hunters).
 

Ziljoe:
Hi Charles,


You mention Slobodin had chest injuries?

"Slobodin having both life threatening fracture injuries in the chest-head area and minor wounds at the back of the hands"

I am not aware of Slobodin having having fractures in the chest area. ( it is possible that I missed this).It has been suggested that his skull fracture was down to freezing and I believe this has been recorded in other cases. Due to Slobodin wearing a hat and having been found with ice under his body there is the possibility that it was freezing that caused the fracture of the skull.

It is interesting that the ravine four have no marks on the backs of their hands. This could support the theory that they died instantly from a snow collapse at the location of the ravine, from above .

I also understand that some of the marks are consistent with victims of hyperthermia  or freezing.

Just my penny's worth.

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