Theories Discussion > General Discussion
Possible reconstructions: yes you might be able to do one!
Investigator:
I have said in other posts I am rather disappointed that no investigation that has been reasonably well funded has tried to simply recreate the conditions that night to see what would happen. That means perhaps getting some healthy college student volunteers and putting them up there under similar weather conditions, in two old army tents sewn together that begin to rip apart under much better conditions, with no sleeping bags, just a wool blanket each, etc. That will cost a bit, though one could try to do this in an area anywhere in the world that gets that kind of cold weather/heavy winds.
However, even easier and cheaper would be to wait for it to snow at least a few inches, wearing the least amount of clothing worn by any Dyatlov group member, then go outside and do a lot of physical work, as they did (securing the tent, ripping a bunch of branches off trees, digging out the "den," and starting a robust fire), then sit in front of that kind of camp fire and see what happens. I think hypothermia will set in quickly so if you do this, have a couple of people dressed well who can get you into a warm house quickly if necessary.
I'll also mention that some have pointed out that the bodies were quite dirty when found. This does not surprise me, because they ripped all those branches off the trees. When there was no snow cover, the wind coming off that mountain likely embedded tiny bits of earth into the crevices of the tree bark, something you might be able to determine if you go to an area with similar trees and winds. I wish I could do some recreations of my own, but my health would not allow it.
eurocentric:
It would leave the organisers open to all manner of financial liability should anyone get frostbite, or fall from a tree when affected by the cold, and if intending to see if they can make it 1 mile down to the forest unscathed, crossing 5 rocky ridges jutting though the snow, risk them gashing themselves in falls and being permanently scarred.
A man in his 50s was found dead in a tent on the pass a few years ago, ironically found by a party of 9 hikers, although there's no explanation online for how he died.
The new book claims the weather records for that night showed a wind speed of up to 35 metres-per second and -35C, which equates to -63C wind chill.
https://www.calculator.net/wind-chill-calculator.html
The static temperature in the unheated canvas tent would therefore be -25C, and far lower still for any draughts.
It's why some wonder if the tent was ever placed on the ridge by the hikers and was instead in their normal place, a forest, but if it was on the ridge there's more than enough cold to introduce hypothermia, especially if not being able to secure what would in those wind speeds (up to 78mph!) be the buckling and twisting long ridge of the tent in order to suspend a stove.
Also ascending the pass late in the day, and then digging a 12x6 trench in a snow cap as night descends at 4:29pm risks a dangerous sweat in those conditions.
DAXXY:
--- Quote from: eurocentric on February 03, 2021, 08:15:51 AM ---It would leave the organisers open to all manner of financial liability should anyone get frostbite, or fall from a tree when affected by the cold, and if intending to see if they can make it 1 mile down to the forest unscathed, crossing 5 rocky ridges jutting though the snow, risk them gashing themselves in falls and being permanently scarred.
A man in his 50s was found dead in a tent on the pass a few years ago, ironically found by a party of 9 hikers, although there's no explanation online for how he died.
The new book claims the weather records for that night showed a wind speed of up to 35-metres-per second and -35C, which equates to -63 wind chill.
https://www.calculator.net/wind-chill-calculator.html
The static temperature in an unheated canvas tent would therefore be -25C, lower still for any draughts.
It's why some wonder if the tent was ever placed on the ridge by the hikers and was instead in their normal place, a forest, but if it was on the ridge there's more than enough cold to introduce hypothermia, especially if not being able to secure what would in those wind speeds (up to 78mph!) be the buckling and twisting long ridge of the tent in order to suspend a stove.
Also ascending the pass late in the day, and then digging a 12x6 trench in a snow cap as night descends at 4:29pm risks a dangerous sweat in those conditions.
--- End quote ---
It would have to be a group of willing volunteers all taking responsibility for themselves with a safety escape method there also. It would be interesting. They would need to be the same sort of ages and physical ability. It might explain the fact that the tent became too cold to be safe without the stove working and a realistic reason to leave but I would think they would have put their coats and boots on with an orderly evacuation. So I would agree with the tent collapsing and becoming impossible to stay in, and that is why they cut themselves out. But they had flashlights why not just reach in under the canvas and grab the coats and felt boots ? It seems they left the tent in their sleeping clothes with the intention to return later. So did wind collapse the tent and it was so bad outside they just decided to put snow on the tent to keep it flat and go for shelter in the forest ? The urgency was the cold and wind they were in once outside and they knew how near the trees were. Maybe one of them was already suffering from hypothermia. Their primary thought was for the nearest shelter and warmth. Then (I think) came the snow dens which collapsed injuring some of them.
Investigator:
eurocentric, I don't think the weather is a major factor in terms of the explanation, because we know it must have been quite cold and windy. If it was outrageously cold and windy, they would not have been able to secure the tent, get down to the treeline without apparent problem, rip off a whole lot of branches, start a robust campfire, dig out the "den," and then one of them got about halfway back up to the tent after all that (Zina), not wearing proper clothing (at least 7 of them).
DAXXY, I think the coats and boots were either frozen or they didn't want to risk those items getting frozen, which is why they secured the tent the way they did. Rather, it was just a "bad call," thinking it would be highly likely they'd survive if they could just get to the treeline and start a robust fire. I'd be curious to know if the "den" was started right away or only after the fire seemed to be a bad idea. It's certainly possible the idea was for the two guys who were better dressed to dig out the "den" while the others started, then huddled round the fire to warm up. Then they would all go to the "den," lie on a bed of branches, and huddle together until sunrise. Zina saw at least one Yuri die, then was angry or upset, and decided to go back to the tent, thinking Igor didn't know what he was doing. Then Slobodin went after her, hit his head, and lie unconsious. Then Igor goes after her, but hypothermia sets in (and I think they must have been too tired and sweated up for them to be able to get back to the tent, walking directly into the strong winds). I do think that not taking the blankets with them was clearly strange, but if a reconstruction was done, perhaps we would see that it was too windy, and also they couldn't do all that work with blankets wrapped around them. Or they didn't want the blankets to get frozen. There is no way to know what the thought process was, but plenty of people have had the wrong idea about how to survive in the wild, especially in an area they've never visited before under harsh weather conditions, so I don't think it makes sense to say thinks like, "they would have never done" this or that. For example, it's possible that the tent is about to collapse and Igor says, "wake up, we must secure the tent immediately, leave everything where it is and grab hold of the canvas where you can." They then position the canvas as he requests and puts some snow on top, then one flashlight goes on top of that, and then he tells them they will go to the treeline and start a campfire, returning at sunrise.
Missi:
I don't know, but it seems to me people usually don't think for tomorrow if their life is in danger today. Meaning: When they were feeling cold as hell and knew they were at least in danger of freezing to death, why didn't they take at least some of the blankets? Take 3, leave the rest. I'd do that!
And although they were young, they already had several trips in the winterly wild of sibiria. They were living in an area where cold winters are expected. I'd expect them to know that wind and cold are dangerous. And that knowing these things wouldn't make one go out in the cold to secure a tent without shoes and at least a jacket of some kind. Of course it's dangerous in the wild without a proper tent. Having some of the group being incapable to walk or ski because of frostbitten feet is another danger. It is possible to build a shelter in the woods especially with snow around, to keep you warm throughout the night and of course the day. So in my opinion it's much more likely to survive without a tent than with damaged health due to cold...
Then again I never tried camping in the winter and only watched videos about shelter building.
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