Theories Discussion > KGB / Radiation / Military involvement
Kolevatov's device
sarapuk:
--- Quote from: Nigel Evans on May 24, 2019, 01:00:18 PM ---
--- Quote from: sarapuk on May 24, 2019, 12:19:43 PM ---
--- Quote from: Loose}{Cannon on May 22, 2019, 08:05:15 PM ---
--- Quote from: JimIslander on May 22, 2019, 07:52:46 AM ---The device was most likely a Short Wave receiver using a preset frequency. Krivonishenko has a "Copper coil" in one of his pockets found by the searchers. As a Radio Ham i use copper wire antennas. If the US wanted to detect radiation in the area they would have had a U-2 equipped with radiation detector do a fly over.
--- End quote ---
I don't think a flyover would be necessary.... we found out about Trinoble like a week later when radioactive dust on the shoes of powerplant workers all over the planet started setting off the detectors when going to work.
But to your point.... This is why I laugh at the main theory in Russia that basically states members of the DP group were on a secret mission to deliver radioactive material to American spies for analysis, and said spies murdered the very people that were so kind to deliver it none the less in the most inhospitable weather conditions imaginable. nea1 Pure rubbish as we have several ways to detect, and analyze their radiation, and catching it out of the atmosphere is one of them.
To many in Russia still to this day, the Americans are a good boogie-man scapegoat. We have the same individuals in the US ironically that blame the Russians when things don't go their way.
--- End quote ---
Absolutely. Its a shame that despite the demise of the USSR we still have people today, and many of them in positions of power, who want to pit Russia against the USA. A term often used is RUSSOPHOBIA and clearly it matters not whether there is Communism or Capitalism.
--- End quote ---
The KGB are back in power and old habits die hard.
--- End quote ---
The KGB ended with the demise of the USSR. In its place we have the FSB and the SVR. One dealing with internal matters and the other with external matters. Most States have some kind of Security Organisation. And any organisation is only as good as the people in it. And mistakes happen. ETC ETC. The bigger the State the more complicated the organisation can become.
Monika:
--- Quote from: Loose}{Cannon on May 22, 2019, 08:05:15 PM ---
--- Quote from: JimIslander on May 22, 2019, 07:52:46 AM ---The device was most likely a Short Wave receiver using a preset frequency. Krivonishenko has a "Copper coil" in one of his pockets found by the searchers. As a Radio Ham i use copper wire antennas. If the US wanted to detect radiation in the area they would have had a U-2 equipped with radiation detector do a fly over.
--- End quote ---
I don't think a flyover would be necessary.... we found out about Trinoble like a week later when radioactive dust on the shoes of powerplant workers all over the planet started setting off the detectors when going to work.
But to your point.... This is why I laugh at the main theory in Russia that basically states members of the DP group were on a secret mission to deliver radioactive material to American spies for analysis, and said spies murdered the very people that were so kind to deliver it none the less in the most inhospitable weather conditions imaginable. nea1 Pure rubbish as we have several ways to detect, and analyze their radiation, and catching it out of the atmosphere is one of them.
To many in Russia still to this day, the Americans are a good boogie-man scapegoat. We have the same individuals in the US ironically that blame the Russians when things don't go their way.
--- End quote ---
Where did you get the information that the theory about “group were on a secret mission to deliver radioactive material to American spies for analysis” is the main theory in Russia for explaining Dyatlov mystery?
With such a theory, Rakitin came and wrote a fictional story and it is questionable whether he believed this theory himself. I read more reviews on his book (in Russian) and translated it through a Google translator and found that almost none of reviewers believed it!
The agent theory about radioactive material and spies is so stupid that it doesn't deserve any comment. neg1
And I think most people in Russia and around the world take this theory with joke! Russian citizens are not stupid or paranoid. Maybe in the USA only, the mainstream media and government agencies are expanding their negative reputation as they do in Russia about Americans.
WAB:
--- Quote from: Monika on May 26, 2019, 10:51:47 PM ---
Where did you get the information that the theory about “group were on a secret mission to deliver radioactive material to American spies for analysis” is the main theory in Russia for explaining Dyatlov mystery?
--- End quote ---
--- Quote from: Monika on May 26, 2019, 10:51:47 PM ---With such a theory, Rakitin came and wrote a fictional story and it is questionable whether he believed this theory himself. I read more reviews on his book (in Russian) and translated it through a Google translator and found that almost none of reviewers believed it!
--- End quote ---
I can support this opinion as was well informed, practically since when it reflected and written.
Rakitin (its present a surname - Riabuhin) has started collect the information on theme of Dyatlov group incident in 2010 at forum https://pereval1959.kamrbb.ru/ (earlier it was called https://pereval1959.forum24.ru/ ) as nickname “ Желтый волк - Yellow wolf”.
For example here: https://pereval1959.kamrbb.ru/?x=read&razdel=35&tema=64#main_64 it is in Russian.
He there was not one, and together with Evgenie Novitsky (it as I believe, his co-author) under nickname «Vitamin» and his one more friend more.
The basic information it took from this forum, and subsequently from several others. Therefore there is no its any special role in research of Dyatlov incident. Further it simply has altered it, adding invented essence under the commercial project, and on it all has ended.
There is nothing surprising that public likes read about invented adventures and «spy novels» more. Actually practically everything that he writes, grows out of inventions and anything similar was not in the nature. In particular I can specify absolutely precisely in weight of the false facts which do not prove be true in any way, and many and are frankly denied by the validity.
1.Absolutely far-fetched navigation of flight “the plane landing parachutists”. Judging by performance characteristics RB-47 plane, it could not reach even borders of the USSR in the south, without speaking what to return on real point of refuelling. One of my military specialities it is the navigator of the scout plane (radioprospecting and counteraction). Therefore it is very easy count and present it.
2.Never RB-47 had updatings for landing parachutists. For this purpose it is necessary alter design that has not been made thoroughly. In 1960 when the similar plane has been brought down over territory of the USSR, operators of radio equipment could not get out from plane because so its design has been calculated. Was considered that it is impregnable and there is no necessity rescue these operators.
3.The Plane "should be" fly directly through air defence zones (which to it did not react in any way, probably because it was not resolved by their religion grin1 ) three of which should get on flight route. It is not necessary speak, what even at that time the most part of air borders of the USSR was looked through radar station. The case with U-2 is other case. That plane flied at heights where there was no aircraft which could get it. However RB-47 could not fly at such heights. Its altitude was more low, than any fighter of air defence of the USSR for that time.
4.The way and movement tactics on the earth (on N.Ural's snow is not described Absolutely not!) when even problem to collect group after a landing in those conditions, represented a serious problem. Even in the afternoon when nobody disturbs. Including here weather, which there (if to tell very softly!) the unpredictable. If Rakitin (Riabuhin) itself would try move there even in the perfect conditions he would not began write such nonsense. Truth it does not describe it, and simply holds back it. It is such version of lie.
5.In different special services there is no such term (and concepts) as "controlled delivery". It is the term from criminal police use.
6.The Principle of any division of investigation - receive maximum information, and silently and imperceptibly escape to itself, delivering this information to staff itself. How operated (on Rakitin!) these "parachutists", it is example of full nonprofessionalism. After such operation them would dismiss without pension and more anybody them for work would not take. If such "professional" leaves after itself so much proofs and displays all bodies, as at theatre it simply is not suitable for trade.
7. "Returning" this group back with the help «skyhook», is a separate theme for me. That Rakitin has described, children of younger age who do not know anything about this adaptation, except the name can read it only. I was engaged in working out of similar device and well I know its characteristics and possibility.
A) Historically there (at Rakitin) all is described, how lies. For the first time after tests (probably that “ferst” Rakitin does not know English word on sense) it applied in 1962, at operation on research of the Soviet polar drifting station in Arctic regions, in zone of the international sea. Here in this article all is described: https://www.cia.gov/library/center-for-the-study-of-intelligence/kent-csi/vol38no5/html/v38i5a11p.htm
B) In article complexities with weather when it was possible make it are well described. On N.Ural of such weather never happens, in places where application of this device is possible. There the minimum wind is 15 m/s (30 kt) and more practically always.
C) Some features of application can be seen in this article: http://www.networkworld.com/community/blog/cia-flying-skyhook-wasnt-just-james-bond-it-actually-rescued-agents .
There it is well visible that during this period such system was applied, as twin (on 2 persons) because it allowed lower vertical overload at the expense of increase in weight of cargo.
D) Rakitin everywhere have substitution of one plane to another, in particular RB-47 and C-47. But others are mentioned also, for example, B-17 and P2V. However not be told anywhere about how they in general could get to N.Ural if at them the action radius was for this purpose obviously insufficient, and their equipment was unique and inaccessible for this purpose in 1959 and later. The question on how they in general could fly freely over territory of the USSR does not rise at all.
8.In his book it is lot of ideas which are frank perversion of role and destinies of some Dyatlov group participants. For example, Simeon Zolotaryov and Alexander Kolevatov. There is not present (and cannot be, because it was not in the nature) on their participation in something. It is all becomes semihints and overthrow information that does not prove be true in any way, neither relatives of these people, nor with what or documents.
9.There were basic questions which should arise in the beginning (but are not written in any way and on them there are no answers):
A)What for all it "circus show" in such solitude (what it is possible give all more close, easier and more reliably) if same can be spent easily near to city, for example on whose that to summer residence, or in general in the Kungursky cave at excursion? There at all there were no restrictions for visiting by foreign tourists, as it is to Sverdlovsk.
B)What it is possible receive from the rests of these clothes even if all is taken not known from what place it?
As is confidential (and important problem for understanding) it is : technology of manufacturing, capacity of manufacture, quantity of the turned out and prepared material. The structure (on geted clothes there were many different impurity which were not necessary, or were false) was known for long time already.
In one word, I can tell about it the same, as have told still in 2010: it is example of antiscientific fantasy and the commercial project which does not contain any solution of this incident.
If it is pleasant to other public, its readers and fans, it yet does not mean that it is truth, at least even partly.
All who knows this book share on 2 categories:
1.Those who is fans, and them more interests nothing, except fascinating reading “about spies”.
2.Those who though what that well understands and sees obvious discrepancy of the validity. They write negative reviews. It is lot of them, but Rakitin (Riabuhin) and has not answered their one direct question in essence. He only is rude in the answer if the question is not pleasant to he. Or, as for example, for the newspaper “Komsomolskia Pravda” demands impossible quantity of money for interview, , what it not give. Because publicly and openly he will be caught in lie.
Therefore so it is lot of people who do not trust (deny) its theory if they are well familiar with details of this event.
--- Quote from: Monika on May 26, 2019, 10:51:47 PM ---The agent theory about radioactive material and spies is so stupid that it doesn't deserve any comment. neg1
And I think most people in Russia and around the world take this theory with joke! Russian citizens are not stupid or paranoid. Maybe in the USA only, the mainstream media and government agencies are expanding their negative reputation as they do in Russia about Americans.
--- End quote ---
Exactly! Reaction to this theory, not as on joke, and as on stupid forcing spy-mania.
Interesting that fact, when I have told to Donnie Eicher about this theory he has taken offence. How much I have understood, for the his country. Also he has correctly made. Any statement and furthermore accusation, should have truthfulness in the basis. I too can will take offence for the country, because when about it tell silly fables its citizens it reminds me Judas Iskariot from it 30 silversmiths. Matter is not in volume what special service of whom has changed (it always goes with variable success - look at history), and what not to force spy-mania there where it at all it was not planned.
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And now it is necessary tell about theme of this section: Kolevatov device.
At first I should notice that Kolevatov was not the radio technician. Therefore no coils condensers and resistors were necessary for he. He studied on branch of nuclear physics. Radio engineerings were Woodpeckers, Kolmogorov and Doroshenko.
It is possible dream long on theme of "nuclear high-speed sledge», but all is much easier: Alexander Kolevatov tried make usual sledge of spare skis and available subjects. On them it is easier transport cargo, for example, backpacks. This craze of that period at all ski travellers. As experience of use of such devices yet was not, all moved ahead "trial and error method". Their big part was unsuccessful, therefore and has not been told in diaries of anything, besides joke seriously concerning the next failure.
On another there also could not be, because conditions of application this adaptation have not been considered. Always on deep snow sledge loses in efficiency of transportation. Because resistance movement happens very high. Therefore many forces should be spent for nothing. It turns out that easier (less expense of forces) carry cargo on back (in backpack).
The design of sledge has been simultaneously badly chosen and made. Absence of experience and preliminary careful designing of these sledge has yielded negative result.
If the design was more successful this sledge could very well it is useful at movement by the top part of ridge where there are no woods and snow is more dense.
A bit later so it has been made by some skilled groups of travellers on skis when they travelled on areas without wood. It, for example, Polar Ural Mountains and many areas of the Russian (or other) North. All these travellers in advance carefully developed designs and made the sledge at professional level. Then all did it on the basis of skis, and then (in 70th and 80th years) began apply entirely cast (or stamped) from plastic. However it was favourable apply them only in areas where there are no many woods.
As Kolevatov was at the very beginning period of application such sledge he has failed. It not its error, and absence of experience such use and absence of understanding as it is necessary do. In due course all would turn out, when there would be experience. But the misfortune with group has not given possibility to Alexander Kolevatovu continue these employment.
GeneralFailure:
"THE RADIOLOGICAL ACCIDENT IN LIA, GEORGIA".
https://www-pub.iaea.org/MTCD/Publications/PDF/Pub1660web-81061875.pdf
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