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Dyatlov Pass Forum

Author Topic: Expedition July 30-August 11, 2022  (Read 2340 times)

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September 01, 2022, 06:56:08 AM
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Teddy

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https://dyatlovpass.com/gallery-expedition-2022

I will develop this topic once I catch up on notes and investigations.
Currently two important findings are in my care:

« Last Edit: September 01, 2022, 09:12:38 AM by Teddy »
 
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September 01, 2022, 01:26:10 PM
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MDGross


Hi Teddy, First of all, thank you for all the great photos. It's a thrill for me to see The cedar, The ravine, the labaz, etc. in such detail!!!

And you made two great findings, which could lead to a scenario like this:
On their last night, the Dyatlov group camped near The cedar. The remains of the campfire found by the search party wasn't built to attempt to keep the hikers warm; it was a cooking fire from the night of Feb. 1. What remains of the tin can contained food that they ate that night. As they slept that night, the fallen cedar you photographed is the tree that fell on the tent.
Great detective work, Teddy. I'm just sorry that Igor is not here to share in the excitement.
 
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September 01, 2022, 01:49:14 PM
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GlennM


Do we have autopsy evidence of milk consumption? This is an exciting find.
 

September 01, 2022, 03:37:30 PM
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Jean Daniel Reuss




                     Reply #1
.......................................................
On their last night, the Dyatlov group camped near The cedar.
............................................


This is the assumption embodied in many serious explanatory theories - including "1079" - but it is not proven with certainty.

If, like sarapuk, you want to remain logically rigorous you must admit that there are many questions that remain unanswered for certainty.


Was the fire under the cedar lit by the hikers or by other people? If it was other people (who had their own food), was it by chance or with hostile intent?

And at what time (was the fire lit) in relation to the coming of darkness (5 PM I think).

Were the beds of branches in the Den built by the hikers or by others?

There remain a multitude of scenarios that are deemed more or less likely  : depending on the temperaments of the author and readers.

For example, with the arrival of a wolverine in the tent on the slope according to Igor B., the fire could have been intended to lure hikers to a fake rescue station.
Jean Daniel Reuss

Rational guidance =

• There is nothing supernatural and mysterious about the injuries suffered by the Dyatlov group. They are all consistent with an attack by a group of professional killers who wanted to take the lives of the nine  [Per Inge Oestmoen].

• Now let us search for answers to: WHO ? WHY ? HOW ?

• The scenario must be consistent with the historical, political and psychological  contexts.

• The solution takes in consideration all known findings.
 

September 01, 2022, 05:36:44 PM
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marieuk


Can't wait to hear more.  Your backpack looks almost as big as you! 
 

September 02, 2022, 12:54:43 AM
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Teddy

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Do we have autopsy evidence of milk consumption? This is an exciting find.

6 cans of condensed milk 250g are found in the labaz: Maslennikov notebook 2



Case files 8-10: Protocol inspection of the storage (labaz)
« Last Edit: September 02, 2022, 01:06:28 AM by Teddy »
 
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September 02, 2022, 11:53:24 AM
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neni_cesty_zpet


Well done. Very nice expedition in remote wilderness, I like that.
You've made amazing discoveries, the milk tin and trunk of fallen tree, possibly the culprit of traumatic wounds.

I've read your book 1079 and I will read it again, paying more attention to details.

Reading thin book called The Dyatlov pass Post Mortem now.
I am imaginating all of them climbing/hiding on tree and falling down. A branch could cause Zinaida's graze wound.

The found tin is evidence of camping near the cedar tree and trunk adds support to your theory of fallen tree onto ten.

Still scratching my head a lot, cannot accept the idea that someone was staging the scene, it's really hard to allow the possibility for me...  dunno1

Good luck putting the pieces of puzzle together !  thumb1
« Last Edit: September 02, 2022, 12:28:13 PM by neni_cesty_zpet »
 

September 02, 2022, 12:15:17 PM
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neni_cesty_zpet


Teddy, were you observing the trunk in detail? I mean, was it uprooted?

If it were tampered in any way, than it would supports the suspicion of third-party involvement and reason to stage the scene to avoid court trial.

I see that it's massively covered with vegetation but if there is some method to visualize the trunk...would require technology and know-how, maybe it's not even feasible...  dunno1

It's quite possible that the evidence is still there and fragments appear from time to time, like that milk tin discovery...

Can't wait for result of radiocarbon dating...
« Last Edit: September 02, 2022, 12:35:34 PM by neni_cesty_zpet »
 

September 02, 2022, 01:47:19 PM
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Teddy

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Teddy, were you observing the trunk in detail? I mean, was it uprooted?

It was it uprooted



 

September 02, 2022, 05:45:02 PM
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GlennM


It certainly seems improbable that hikers would leave their tent at elevation 880 and hike to the forest, some without proper clothes, but would carry a can of condensed milk.  Yet, it seems improbable that a tent crushed by a tree would be restored by conspirators to  the place where it was found by rescuers. I appreciate the commitment of those who pilgrimage to the location seeking closure and truth.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2022, 09:29:51 PM by GlennM »
 

September 03, 2022, 12:52:37 AM
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Teddy

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Yet, it seems improbable that a tent crushed by a tree would be restored by conspirators to  the place where it was found by rescuers.

Initially the rescue was normal, bodies flown to the nearest morgue, investigation began, the tent was folded and taken to Ivdel the same way they did end of February, the second time they "found" it.
When the conspirators decided to stage the scene they pitched the tent where the labaz was found marked exactly as it was found where found at their nearest camp site. Igor and i believe that the conspirators used the hole that was made for the labaz to stage the tent. They left the footprints going down to rest the bodies where they found them.

This human behavior is called body dump so the people who are doing it are not blamed for causing the death which they didn't but explain this to the Communist Party. Who else is going to be the scapegoat?
 
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September 03, 2022, 11:20:46 AM
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Manti


Is it possible that the tent wasn't even supposed to be staged on the slope, that the people tasked with returning it were different from those who found it, and simply made a mistake? And in fact should have been set it up somewhere else, in the forest?


Their planned route: 217 miles in 15 days. That's 14 miles a day.
On their last day, they covered 1.5 miles. Why?
 
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September 03, 2022, 01:21:45 PM
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GlennM


For me, the elephant in the middle of the room is there were no identifiable prints leading to the tent at 880. Also, I must check my facts. I thought the Labaz was elsewhere. If it was at 880, what became of the property?
 

September 04, 2022, 12:22:40 AM
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Teddy

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For me, the elephant in the middle of the room is there were no identifiable prints leading to the tent at 880. Also, I must check my facts. I thought the Labaz was elsewhere. If it was at 880, what became of the property?

It is confusing when you say 880 because there is a height that is called that and there is nothing there.



In our version the labaz was originally where the tent was found by Slobtsov and Sharavin on Feb 26.
Findign the labaz, bodies and tent (in this order because of their location and the presumption that there were spotted by air and ground group was sent out to check) proceeded the same way as it did end of February, only early February. Bodies were sent to the morgue, tent was folded and sent to Ivdel together with the supplies from the labaz. Because the labaz was right there on the ridge. Then the investigation started on February 6 for the Shumkov's group (Case files 48). When Shumkov's group came back alive they transferred the document to a new investigation about the missing Dyatlov group. You are asking "what became of the property"? Same thing that happened with the supplies of the labaz when it was found, again, on March 2, 1959 - it was protocoled and taken away (eaten). In the case of the earlier discovery there was not yet investigator to protocol the contents of the labaz.

There are many fishy things about the labaz being where it was officially found. This is not how you make a labaz in the forest, but when there are no trees. You can read here: https://dyatlovpass.com/labaz
But what convinced me the most is how hard it is to find. There is no way the Dyatlov group could have found it on their way back. Even with a trail, it took the searchers 5 days to see it 10m from the trail they were going up and down everyday. How is this possible? Also not a single bite from animals? When the frozen bodies were carried to the famous outlier rock at no point of time were they left alone because of the animals. But all the provisions were lying down (not hanging on trees as they were supposed to) for a month and no animal activity? 4kg of sausages on the ground from Jan 31 to Mar 2?
« Last Edit: September 04, 2022, 12:42:18 AM by Teddy »
 
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September 04, 2022, 08:47:26 AM
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MDGross


In wintertime, wouldn't the labaz have been marked with a ski pole or something else easy to spot above the snow? Not sure why animals didn't eat some of the food. Does frozen food have an odor? I don't know.
 

September 04, 2022, 11:43:40 AM
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GlennM


Teddy, your diagram helps me make my point. The diagram shows the tent at 880. There are identifiable prints leading away, not toward. Therefore, I find it impossible for conspirators to bring the tent up to 880 from the forest below and not leave trace evidence of their ascent. Even as I say this, you could counter me with, " Where are the tracks over Dyatlov Pass, if the hikers came that way?" But surely, the conspirators would use a sledge drawn by a pack animal to relocate both the tent and the Labaz. I doubt the geologists had this equipment, so there would be local involvement. If some local could profit by exposing the negligence of geologists, it surely would have happened. The government would have their fall guy, and the case resolved.

I find it improbable that to cover up a logging accident, the conspirators would relocate the tent to 880 and then relocate the cache that was supposedly at 880 over the ridge and down into the next valley. They do all of that and yet leave corpses around. They do all that and do not confiscate writing materials or film.

I do admire and respect you giving a measure of your young life to obtaining closure to this mystery. That said, perhaps the solution is in the written Soviet archives and a medical lab somewhere else. I am reminded that Spanish treasure ships are more readily discovered by searching the archives in Seville than by exploring swathes of open ocean.
 

September 04, 2022, 03:31:05 PM
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Ziljoe


I don't fully understand why they would place the labaz at the location on the slope? For a number of reasons.

1 , they would know that that the wind blows and what is deep one day could be eroded the next, exposing their cache. Or it could be buried , even with a ski marking the spot?

2, if it was staged , why did the people replace the tent at the labaz location  then move the cache ? Why transport it to another location? Why not leave all the stuff together in the tent?
 

September 04, 2022, 05:41:19 PM
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Manti


@Ziljoe:
If you think as a conspirator: something must be on the slope. There is a photo of them digging there. Unless you of course make that photo disappear.

So the tent must be there. Because if the labaz is there then where was the tent? Below in the forest? Supposedly, this is exactly what they were trying to cover up.

@GlennM:
When you write 880, it's confusing because there's a peak that's 880m tall and like Teddy says there was nothing there, it's not involved in the incident but it's there on the maps.

But I see what you mean. What if a helicopter dropped the conspirators off, along with the tent? And later landed lower down the slope to pick them up, hence the footprints?

Seems like a lazy job of a cover-up, though, to leave behind footprints like that...

« Last Edit: September 04, 2022, 05:46:12 PM by Manti »

Their planned route: 217 miles in 15 days. That's 14 miles a day.
On their last day, they covered 1.5 miles. Why?
 

September 04, 2022, 06:26:07 PM
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Ziljoe


@Manti

As I understand Teddys version.  The argument is that the labaz was made first on the slope That is what the last photos show by teddy's account.  The debate is that the tent was staged and put in that location after the tree had fallen  on them in the woods.
 

September 04, 2022, 10:01:15 PM
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GlennM


My apologies to all for reference to 880. I meant elevation 880 on 1079, but failed to appreciate there is a separate hill called 880. My bad. That said, I think taking a helicopter to fly a ruined tent from the forest to where it was found on 1079 is giving the geologists a lot more influence than I would expect. Certainly, someone would have noticed. Too, I can not for the life of me believe that someone would busy themselves relocating a tent and Labaz while ignoring the whereabouts of dead people. If, on the other hand, the dead were brought in for autopsy and then the geologists later on went and obfuscated the scene by relocating the tent and cache, it certainly seems like a lot of effort expended to hide something that could just as easily be explained away as a natural occurrence. That is, a tree branch fell in the woods. It happens all the time. No, I think the hikers camped on 1079, experienced a collapse of their tent, misjudged their situation and endurance and died as described.

Teddy reports the condensed milk tin found in the woods. Would that be the only discard? Would the nine hikers throw rubbish aside or pack it out?
 
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September 05, 2022, 03:19:06 AM
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Игорь Б.


In our version the labaz was originally where the tent was found by Slobtsov and Sharavin on Feb 26.
Вы знаете, что место лабаза и место последней ночёвки дятловцев на Ауспии это одно и то же?
http://1723.ru/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=5133&view=findpost&p=62048
An example of the impact of chemical weapons of a skunk (wolverine) in a tent:
http://1723.ru/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=5133&view=findpost&p=117054
 

September 05, 2022, 07:01:38 AM
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Teddy

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September 05, 2022, 07:18:15 PM
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GlennM


How exciting it must have been for you to find historical clues and have your hands on the evidence. What a life of adventure you have. I appreciate your visual record of the retrieval of the artifacts.
 
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September 06, 2022, 02:43:05 PM
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Ziljoe


In our version the labaz was originally where the tent was found by Slobtsov and Sharavin on Feb 26.
Вы знаете, что место лабаза и место последней ночёвки дятловцев на Ауспии это одно и то же?
http://1723.ru/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=5133&view=findpost&p=62048

That's an interesting photo comparison. Certainly looks like the same tree.
 

September 06, 2022, 06:39:19 PM
Reply #24
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GlennM


I am no expert on materials analysis, but I wonder at the degree to which the canned milk container was ruined. I can see using the can and just tossing it. I can see using the can and hand crushing it as a macho thing. It seems to me that the twisted and fragmentary nature of the can would get that way if someone was needing a knife edge or trying to make a reflector of some sort. I wonder if autopsy findings supported milk ingestion, or was it too late for that?
 

September 06, 2022, 07:11:58 PM
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Ziljoe


I can see the searcher's having a tin of condensed milk at the time of the search. I can also see the dyatlov group chucking tins to the side. it wasn't today's recycling society. I would suspect no one at that time thought about the environment.
 

September 06, 2022, 09:31:10 PM
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Charles

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« Last Edit: December 15, 2022, 10:00:54 PM by Charles »
 

September 06, 2022, 10:01:06 PM
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Charles

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« Last Edit: December 15, 2022, 10:00:39 PM by Charles »
 

September 07, 2022, 12:22:49 AM
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Teddy

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That is the right question to answer. We can imagine that they were forced to leave the tent barefoot for 7/9 of them, ok, but why not just to walk down to the labaz ? Why not to step back in their footprints leading directly to the food and shoes ?

The keyword being imagine. We don't know any of this.
According to my theory none of what you describe happened. Here is my theory for reference.
Whoever imagines the scenario you describe can answer your questions.
 

September 07, 2022, 12:31:26 AM
Reply #29
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Teddy

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I can see the searcher's having a tin of condensed milk at the time of the search.

Karelin said none of them would carry a can leave alone open it under the cedar. His words were "no way".
« Last Edit: September 07, 2022, 12:41:18 AM by Teddy »