rotten cedar

[Почемучка]

I support your position that rules out hostile human intervention. You favor a natural explanation as do I. Infrasound and ball lightning together might have happened, but do you find that probable? Regarding ball lightning, it is a curious phenonoma. Can we claim there was a shock hazard? We know several tourists had burns, but the usual explanation is fire. Might they think a missile was coming at them? I would run away ( but would probably die anyway).

Infrasound on the other hand would begin to raise fears. Each hiker would have perhaps a different fear. It is true and well documented that group hysteria is a real thing. When fear becomes panic, all the higher mental functions stop. The result is to "freeze" through inaction, run away or blindly fight. We know they took action. There is some physical evidence of the deceased to support an altercation. There is reason to think that in a panic, shoes would not be put on feet. However, I would expect footprints indicative of running. Do you think that snowdrifts covered those running footsteps most near the tent? Could it be that when they came to their senses, they all decided to seek shelter in the woods? If it was darkmand moonless, they may have misjudged the distance to the valley.

Мелкие детали можно разбирать бесконечно. Главным же нужно понять - почему могли уйти из палатки побросав все нужное не пытаясь забрать сразу же. Я не вижу ничего подходящего кроме двух мною уже - названных.
Страх до уровня бесконтрольного ужаса от инфразвука или страх попасть под поражающий фактор шаровой молнии, которая притягивается всеми металлическими предметами, вплоть до замков-молний на одежде или пуговиц из металла. Второе им как студентам технических специальностей - было более чем понятно в части опасности.

Small parts can be disassembled endlessly. The main thing is to understand why they could leave the tent leaving everything they needed without trying to pick it up right away. I don’t see anything suitable other than the two I’ve already named.
Fear to the level of uncontrollable horror from infrasound or fear of falling under the damaging factor of ball lightning, which is attracted by all metal objects, including zippers on clothes or metal buttons. The second thing was that they, as technical students, were more than clear about the danger.

[Axelrod]

I believe that Yarovoy’s book is fiction, and in no way should it be used. Only a visit to Otorten is misinformation.
His book is very weak, suitable for a regional publishing house.

Yarovoy himself probably did not imagine that his book would be used to study the incident, otherwise he would have written differently. And one must understand that for Yarovoy the main goal was his book, and not the investigation.

[Почемучка]

I believe that Yarovoy’s book is fiction, and in no way should it be used. Only a visit to Otorten is misinformation.
His book is very weak, suitable for a regional publishing house.

Yarovoy himself probably did not imagine that his book would be used to study the incident, otherwise he would have written differently. And one must understand that for Yarovoy the main goal was his book, and not the investigation.

Тогда гляньте в список использованной литературы в книге Теодоры...
Then take a look at the list of references in Theodora's book...

[GlennM]

As long as we remember that our subjects are dead longer than many of us have lived, we proceed. For infrasound to be confirmed, it would have been nice if the rescue  teams experienced it. Mansi legends of the whispering mountain would be nice, but alas! In fact, do we have any evidence since that time of infrasound measured at 1079?

Can we document anyone being scared to death or otherwise making a fatal mistake owing to ball lightning? Sailors in wooden ships knew of Saint Elmo's Fire. They did nothing rash because of it. Ball lightning, a one time phenomona, might indeed elicit fear.It could also elicit wonder. Would this compel a sane person, with outdoor experience and university education in the sciences to walk a mile in the snow without shoes at night?

As always, we return to the reason they left the tent. As always, the reasons we give are about things which seem to leave no trace. Of those many causes that we've explored, only two have supporting physical evidence. One evidence is the snow covered tent area, the other is a fallen tree in the woods. Of those two, the snow requires least additional assumptions.

If I understand correctly, fallen snow hardens differently depending on temperature, wind and volume. Since it has been established the temperature and snowfall varied, is not the idea that two dissimilar layers of snow could slip when a wall was cut in the snowbank to level the tent? Much has been made about the area not being avalance prone.

We remember that the hikers footprints did not end in the forest because they were covered by a snow layer. We also know that if an obstruction is put before blowing snow, the snow will pile up. If the hikers threw snow in the direction of the uphill side of their snow bank, the bank enlarges and becomes heavier.

[Axelrod]

Тогда гляньте в список использованной литературы в книге Теодоры...
Then take a look at the list of references in Theodora's book...

Я считаю, что Игорь Павлов сделал некоторые неверные выводы из книги Ярового, использовав ее в качестве достоверного источника.

I believe that Igor Pavlov drew some incorrect conclusions from Yarovoy’s book, using it as a reliable source.

Video in Russian

[Axelrod]

Since it has been established the temperature and snowfall varied, is not the idea that two dissimilar layers of snow could slip when a wall was cut in the snowbank to level the tent? Much has been made about the area not being avalance prone.

Your way of thought is understandable, but everything was as it was, and everything happened as it happened. This case is not a fantasy. as the Swedish Wikipedia administrators considered... Your eyes didn’t see everything, so you can’t say 100% that it was a snow slab. If there was no snow slab, how else can you explain this event?

[GlennM]

Your way of thought is understandable, but everything was as it was, and everything happened as it happened. This case is not a fantasy. as the Swedish Wikipedia administrators considered... Your eyes didn’t see everything, so you can’t say 100% that it was a snow slab. If there was no snow slab, how else can you explain this event?

Thank you for understanding me. It is true that things happened then and was as it was, nor is it a fantasy. True, my eyes didn't see everything. My mind tells me this; first, if the disaster was the result a temporary phenomona, we can not expect that the phenomona will persist over days or weeks for the edification of investigators. Yet, we do have evidence of snow on the tent, broken ski poles and clothing left behind. We do understand that layers of snow can and do slip over each other under the right conditions. I support the latest official Russian findings for the loss of the DP9. They were driven out of their tent by an overburden of snow what could not easily be removed at the time. They retreated to the forest, but three attempted to return and died.

"If there was no snow slab, how else can you explain this event?" If there was a snow slab, then that is sufficient explanation.
For me, it is the simplest and most truthful explanation of the beginning to the DP9's demise.

[Axelrod]

"If there was no snow slab, how else can you explain this event?" If there was a snow slab, then that is sufficient explanation.
For me, it is the simplest and most truthful explanation of the beginning to the DP9's demise.

How do you look at the logic: If there was an avalanche in a flat field, then that’s enough...

you raised a very interesting question. The snow slab is needed to explain what happened.
But if it can be explained in another way (for example, the explosion of an abstract vacuum bomb or abstract infrasound), then the question arises: is an avalanche possible there in principle? Is an avalanche possible in that place once every 20 years? Once every 100 years?

Those. the cause of the incident was different (for example, a vacuum bomb), but is an avalanche with other tourists possible there now with such consequences? What will the researchers say?
-----------------
Как вы смотрите на логику: Если в ровном поле была лавина, то этого достаточно...

вы поставили очень интересный вопрос. Снежная плита нужна для того, чтобы объяснить проиpошедшее.
Но если можно объяснить другим способом (например, взрыв абстрактной вакуумной бомбы или абстрактный инфразвук), то возникает вопрос, а возможна ли там снежная лавина в принципе? Возможна ли лавина в том месте раз в 20 лет? Раз в 100 лет?

Т.е. причина происшествия была другая (для примера, вакуумная бомба), но возможна ли там сейчас лавина с другими туристаvи с таким последствиями?  Что скажут исследователи?

[GlennM]

https://www.stuff.co.nz/environment/350159199/ball-fire-seen-travelling-across-central-north-island-sky

[Ziljoe]

They said there was no avalanches in the area at all when I started reading. Then it was found that avalanches happen about 2miles away, then it was found that avalanches happen about 800 meters away. They possibly just need to "think " there was an avalanche.

Ball lighting I remember reading about many years ago. There doesn't seem to be a lot information other than it might be possible and witness accounts. Ball lightning is usually small from what I understand. I don't know if it would be enough to make me leave the tent for the forest.

I doubt any vacuum bombs would be used in the middle of nowhere, in winter , who's there to record the data?.

[GlennM]

Jan 25  The Dyatlov group was staying at Vizhay, but they were not wasting time. They consulted with Ivan Rempel, a forest officer of the Vizhay forestry, who helped them reconfirm their route, copy the lay-out of the forest plot along their route, and mark up the boundaries of the planted forest. Rempel warned the group of the perils of the route, particularly the heavy winds at the Ural Ridge, but the hikers did not take his warnings seriously. They were looking forward to the evening entertainment, the famous Symphonie in Gold (1956) movie at the local club, followed by a night at the Vizhay hotel.

They knew where they were going, and knew how to get there. They were advised of heavy winds at the Ural Ridge, but dismissed the warning. They wanted entertainment. They went up the hill and things got real. Control is an illusion. Nature got the best of them.

[Axelrod]

In film "Dyatlov Pass. Dismissed due to death" it says:

Evg. Buyanov – Master of Sports in Tourism

[NARRATOR:] A forced overnight stay on an open slope fit perfectly into Dyatlov’s plan to overcome the most difficult conditions.

[BUYANOV:] The last word in Kolmogorova’s diary is Rempel. Rempel is a Vizhay forester who warned Dyatlov and Kolmogorova that the winds in the open part of the mountains are deadly. Their eyes lit up... This is first class for us!

[NARRATOR:] Buyanov believes that a strong gust of hurricane wind could have triggered an avalanche. The snow lost its support when the guys dug for the tent.

[BUYANOV:] I found 3 very similar cases... The avalanche did not go down right away.

[NARRATOR:] But does this version explain the horrific injuries of the dead tourists?

[BUYANOV:] Well, half a ton of load on a person at once! Whose bones can stand it?



В фильме "Перевал Дятлова. Отчислены по случаю смерти" говорится:

Евг.Буянов – мастер спорта по туризму

[ДИКТОР:] Вынужденная ночёвка на открытом склоне прекрасно вписывалась в план Дятлова по преодолению максимально тяжёлых условий.

[БУЯНОВ:] В дневнике Колмогоровой последнее слово – Ремпель. Ремпель – это вижайский лесник, который предупредил Дятлова и Колмогорову, что ветра на открытой части гор смертельно опасны. У них глаза загорелись... Вот это для нас первый класс!

[ДИКТОР:] Буянов считает, что сильный порыв ураганного ветра мог спровоцировать сход лавины. Снег лишился опоры, когда ребята сделали подкоп для палатки.

[БУЯНОВ:] Я нашёл 3 очень похожих случая… Лавина сходила не сразу.

[ДИКТОР:] Но объясняет ли эта версия чудовищные травмы погибших туристов?

[БУЯНОВ:] Ну, полтонны нагрузки на человека сразу! У кого кости выдержат?