Snow avalanche February 14, 2024. What consequences..?

[Олег Таймень]

According to Teddy Hadjiyska, the day before yesterday, February 14, 2024, an avalanche occurred near her home in the Austrian Alps and a woman was caught under it.
A large group of people was climbing from Jonsbach via Ploden to Blazeneck. At the same time, two skiers were descending from the top and triggered an avalanche.
There is no reliable information about the woman’s condition yet, one can only guess.. But there are photographs of the slope. From these photographs we can assess the scale of the disaster..

[Axelrod]

https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/201772189#map=17/47.50002/14.61971&layers=P

[GlennM]

Two observations, in the provided images, the volume of snow is just as important as the depth of snow. Secondly, photos of the hikers tent show windswept snow above the tent and blocks of snow at and below the tent. It is not likely that a snow slide started very far uphill from the tent. It is likely that when the tent did receive the snow, the people inside were justifiably worried and took corrective measures, if for no other reason than the slab slide might develop into something greater.

[Axelrod]

Secondly, photos of the hikers tent show windswept snow above the tent and blocks of snow at and below the tent. It is not likely that a snow slide started very far uphill from the tent. It is likely that when the tent did receive the snow, the people inside were justifiably worried and took corrective measures, if for no other reason than the slab slide might develop into something greater.

Thirdly, fourthy...
I don’t understand how much you can talk about this layer of snow that has moved away as a fait accompli
There was no such thing, there was no such thing! This is a replicated figment of the imagination of my relative Moses Axelrod. and then Buyanov continued. Come up with something more interesting!

If your fantasy is a layer of snow, please write that this is your version and nothing more!

[Partorg]

There was no such thing, there was no such thing! This is a replicated figment of the imagination of my relative Moses Axelrod. and then Buyanov continued. Come up with something more interesting!

How can you know what was there and what wasn’t there, cheburashka? About the snow you only know that it is cold and that if you heat it up, for some reason you always get water.
The unnatural tilt of the ski pole to the left of the tent entrance, which served as a lateral stretch peg, clearly indicates the direction of the force that brought down the tent. What could be the source of this force on a snow-covered slope, if the tent was buried in it with the windward side at least half its height? Lost rocket? Lost mind elk? Drunk bear?
Under certain conditions, snow slides can occur on slopes even gentler than the slope above the DG tent.  The combination of weather phenomena that creates such conditions probably does not occur every winter, but they cannot help but arise sooner or later, and anyone who does not bother to obtain at least some specific knowledge about all this should not speak out on this topic. And even more so so categorically.


Ты откуда можешь знать, что там было и чего не было, чебурашка?  Ведь ты даже о снеге знаешь только то, что он холодный, и что если его нагревать, то всегда почему-то вода получается.
Противоестественный наклон лыжной палки слева от входа в палатку выполнявшей функцию колышка для боковай растяжки, совершенно ясно говорит о направлении силы которая повалила палатку. Что могло быть источником этой силы на склоне покрытом снегом при том что палатка была заглублена в него наветренным бортом как минимум  наполовину своей высоты? Заблудившаяся ракета? Укуренный лось? Пьяный медведь?
При определённых условиях снежные оползни могут происходить на склонах даже более пологих чем склон над палаткой DG.  Комбинация погодных явлений создающая такие  условия возникает наверное не каждую зиму, но они не могут не возникать рано или поздно, и тому кто не утруждает себя получением хоть каких-то конкретных знаний обо всём этом, не стоит на эту тему высказываться вообще. А тем более так безапеляционно.

[eurocentric]

None of the hikers had broken or dislocated limbs, the most common injury in avalanches. It would be remarkable that any kind of snow event, if used to explain broken ribs and head injuries, spared all nine from other fractures.

To explain a tent peg at an angle, quite apart from them usually being knocked in at a slight angle so the rope doesn't slip off, the hurricane winds known to affect the region around the time the hikers died could explain that.

Imagine placing a flag pole into the sands on a beach, away from the tide, you plant it as deep as your strength allows. It wouldn't be surprising, should you return weeks later and after a hurricane, to find the flag pole at an angle and the flag damaged.

This shorter tent pole had a canvas tent acting as a sail, and bamboo poles are not strong enough to act as a mast, one of them snapped twice.

[Axelrod]

The unnatural tilt of the ski pole to the left of the tent entrance, which served as a lateral stretch peg, clearly indicates the direction of the force that brought down the tent. What could be the source of this force on a snow-covered slope, if the tent was buried in it with the windward side at least half its height? Lost rocket? Lost mind elk? Drunk bear?

As a person who studied mathematical analysis at an institute for 2 years (with complete proofs of all theorems that I had to reproduce in all exams), I can say that such a tirade does not mean anything. This style of persuasion refers to deception, not evidence. First of all, from the very beginning. Tilting the stick is not unnatural. There are photographs of a tent where the poles are tilted in different directions. It’s hard to imagine the shift of snow there... The tilt of the stick doesn’t say exactly nothing. On the contrary, if there was a shift in the snow, the stick would most likely break, so the state of the stick indicates the absence of such a shift.

The fact that some snow was moving toward the tent from this side was an illusion, a trick of the imagination.

Я как человек, 2 года изучавший в институте на курс математического анализа (с полными доказательствами всех теорем, которые мне приходилось воспроизводить на всех экзаменах), могу сказать, что  подобная тирада ни о чём не говорит. Подобный стиль убеждения относится очковтирательству, а не к доказательству. Во-первых, с  самого начала. Наклон палки не является противоестественным. Есть фотографии палатки, где палки наклонены  в разных направлениях. Сдвиг снега там сложно представить...Наклон палки не говорит но и чём однозначно. Наоборот, если бы был сдвиг снега, палка скорее бы сломалась, поэтому целое состояние палки говорит об отсутствии такого сдвига.

То, что с этой стороны на палатку двигался какой-то снег, это иллюзия, игра воображения.

[Partorg]

This shorter tent pole had a canvas tent acting as a sail, and bamboo poles are not strong enough to act as a mast, one of them snapped twice.

What could be the source of this force on a snow-covered slope, if the tent was buried in it with the windward side at least half its height?

The photo of preparing the site for the Tent shows that it will be installed so that only the upper half of the roof  will be subject to wind loading  It is unlikely that this would be enough to break or move the pole, but if this did happen, it is unlikely that in a hurricane of such strength they would be able to restore the fallen end of the tent.
In principle, this can be calculated, but laziness, supported by intuition, suggests that such winds do not exist even on the Dome of Antarctica.

None of the hikers had broken or dislocated limbs, the most common injury in avalanches.

1. When they talk about avalanche injuries, they usually mean injuries received in the transit section of the avalanche, when the body moves along the slope in the avalanche flow at a speed of 50 to 100 km/h. In our case, this is out of the question. There could have been a snow slab 15 - 20 cm thick sliding onto the tent, accompanied by a mass of sugar snow with a volume of a hundred m³ and with a transit of 20 - 25 meters.
In principle, a fracture of a limb that unfortunate fell under the slab could have happened and here, but it did not happen.

2. Injuries did not necessarily occur during the landslide. They could have been injured during the descent, on the icy slope at the end of the 3rd stone belt.

[Partorg]

As a person who studied mathematical analysis at an institute for 2 years (with complete proofs of all theorems that I had to reproduce in all exams), I can say that such a tirade does not mean anything. This style of persuasion refers to deception, not evidence. First of all, from the very beginning. Tilting the stick is not unnatural. There are photographs of a tent where the poles are tilted in different directions. It’s hard to imagine the shift of snow there... The tilt of the stick doesn’t say exactly nothing. On the contrary, if there was a shift in the snow, the stick would most likely break, so the state of the stick indicates the absence of such a shift.

1.  The tilt of the peg towards the tent is unnatural. No one ever installs tension anchors in this position.
2.  Whether the stick is broken or just tilted is of no fundamental importance. It is important that she could only be in this position under the influence of force. 3.  If it seems to you that snow movement is impossible here, then that’s your problem. There is no need to pass off your opinion as the voice of God.
4.  I knew a guy who studied math for 4 years, but he remained a fool.


1.  Наклон колышка в сторону палатки является неестественным.
Никто и никогда не устанавливает анкеры под растяжку в такое положение.
2.  Сломана палка или всего лишь наклонена - не имеет принципиального значения. Важно, что оказаться в таком положении она могла только под воздействием силы.
3.  Если тебе кажется, что подвижка снега тут невозможна, то это твои проблемы. Не надо выдавать своё мнение за глас Божий.
4.  Я знал парня который 4 года изучал матан, но так дураком и остался.

[Ziljoe]

There seems to be confusion over the avalanche. My understanding is that there are several proposals.

The main theory is some kind of snow collapse/ avalanche/ snow movement / slab slide, happened at the tent.

From there we have several potential outcomes.

1) avalanche/snow slab caused severe injuries at the tent location, hikers cut their way out , the hikers leave to the forest with the injured.

2) small snow collapse /slab slide. Enough to collapse part of the tent and make the hikers cut their way out of the tent .

3) a big avalanche happened and their bodies were scattered to where they were found all the way to the ravine. ( some people have argued this, honest)

If the visibility was poor at the time of installation of the tent AND at the time of said "avalanche/snow slide", then the decision to move to the safety of the forest may have been justified and deemed reasonable given the perceived threat of more unknown snow coming down a slope where you don't know what lies above.

To share my thoughts on this, I think there could have been a small movement of the existing snow where they cut into the slope, combined with fresh snow that had been drifting over a period of hours that evening/night , loading the slope above . Of course, high winds may have added to the situation or added another complication at that moment in time. All that is needed, is the illusion of a serious threat of an avalanche to make the hikers move away , perhaps we do not need an actual avalanche.

Arguments against obvious questions like, why did they not take more clothes? may be down to the simple fact that the more they dug back into the tent , the more fresh loose snow moved towards them. This may explain the difference in foot wear etc. The angle of the ski pole is interesting, when the ski pole is inverted it is used as a peg, the angle of the ski pole at the front of the tent leans towards the tent , this to me, suggests movement of the body of the snow that the ski pole was in. I think the snow would be firm enough for the ski pole not to tilt by wind over three weeks.

It is a hypothetical  scenario of course, I was never very good at mathematics.....