Zolo's notebook

[GlennM]

From Askinadzi's letter

"When we were getting the bodies out, Zolotaryov had a notebook in one hand and a pencil in the other. Ortyukov rushed to it like a madman, and then suddenly wilted, having found nothing, only saying: "I didn't write anything, damn it." Dear Colonel, if you can hear me in the next world, what would you have written if you had been in the 30-degree frost with bare hands for at least 2 hours...

Why A. Zolotaryov held a notebook and a pencil in his hands and didn't write anything down, one can only guess. Probably, there was no time for this, and my hands were probably already frostbitten up to the elbows."

Zolo was frozen with pencil and paper in hand. He wanted to write but could not. Next to him Lyuda and the others. What would he have said? I am guessing a single word would be all he could do. Would he have written goodbye? His name? Perhaps not. What then would be a one word message he would leave for his rescuers? What would any of us write, were we in that situation?

[SURI]

If it is true that Zolotaryov had a pencil and a notebook in his hands, then the need to write something came only in the ravine. He didn't intend to write anything by the fire. The note would therefore only concern the 4 in the ravine and the reason for their tragedy – "we fell".

So if he had the opportunity to take out his pencil and notebook, he probably wasn't under the snow at the first moment. Which is logical, because otherwise the cause of death would have been suffocation.

That pencil and that notebook would have meant a lot in Zolotaryov's hands. This would rule out a lot of unlikely scenarios.

[amashilu]

If it is true that Zolotaryov had a pencil and a notebook in his hands, then the need to write something came only in the ravine. He didn't intend to write anything by the fire. The note would therefore only concern the 4 in the ravine and the reason for their tragedy – "we fell".

So if he had the opportunity to take out his pencil and notebook, he probably wasn't under the snow at the first moment. Which is logical, because otherwise the cause of death would have been suffocation.

That pencil and that notebook would have meant a lot in Zolotaryov's hands. This would rule out a lot of unlikely scenarios.

I have the same thought, Suri, that if he were holding a pencil and notebook, then how could he have been crushed by a ton of snow that broke his ribs? Also, Lyuda does not look to be in a position of having been crushed by snow.

[MDGross]

If you're dying because of the actions of others, wouldn't you want to spell out who did it? "KGB" or "CIA" or "Mansi" or ...

[Ziljoe]

If it is true that Zolotaryov had a pencil and a notebook in his hands, then the need to write something came only in the ravine. He didn't intend to write anything by the fire. The note would therefore only concern the 4 in the ravine and the reason for their tragedy – "we fell".

So if he had the opportunity to take out his pencil and notebook, he probably wasn't under the snow at the first moment. Which is logical, because otherwise the cause of death would have been suffocation.

That pencil and that notebook would have meant a lot in Zolotaryov's hands. This would rule out a lot of unlikely scenarios.

I have the same thought, Suri, that if he were holding a pencil and notebook, then how could he have been crushed by a ton of snow that broke his ribs? Also, Lyuda does not look to be in a position of having been crushed by snow.

For me, it's more possible to be lying holding a note pad and pen in a snow hole , then the snow collapses from above and causing the damage than any other explanation.

I can't see zolotaryov doing anything with a pen and paper with those injuries, so I conclude that the injuries must have happened whilst holding the pen and note book . If it were an explosion , I don't think they would be in his hands , likewise, I don't think outsiders would let them write things down then break bones.

I don't know how much truth of the report is actually true about the pen and paper as I think it's just one person that reported it.

Excluding a collapse of snow on lyinda , the only thing I could/can think of, is the position she is in , is the only manageable position for the injuries on her ribs for any kind of possible comfort. It would possibly allow her to breath with the least distress on the rib cage , obviously she would not be able to lie on her front . The same for zolotaryov but he wouldn't be lying on his side if he had these wounds , and definitely not holding a pen and paper with those fractures.

[SURI]

If the snow had collapsed from above and Zolotaryov had been holding a pencil and a notebook, they would probably have fallen out of his hands. Also, the position of Tibault's foot indicates a fall rather than anything else, like Dubinina's outstretched arms.

[GlennM]

The ravine was filled over time with blown in and precipitated snowfall. At the depth they were found, the overburden was considerable. I have a tough time contemplating Lyuda being injured and leaning against the ledge for breath while Zolo is trying to write something on a notepad. I would think he would make an attempt at rescue.

Zolo was supposedly found with a notebook and pencil in hand. It must have taken some effort to remove one or both, frozen as they were. The fact that the notebook was not conserved is significant to me. Did it actually exist? At an inquest, wouldn't the question come up whether there were any deathbed messages written? I'd expect the notebook to be produced in evidence then and there with the explanation about the chain of custody.

I think it unlikely that Zolo's notebook was actually something else, like some piece of frozen cloth. No. I also think it unlikely that someone in authority would deliberately make up a phony story about finding and trying to read the notebook. I do think it possible that  the notebook still exists somewhere, for what it is worth, perhaps in a shoebox of mementos. Too, if the notebook existed, then Zolo would be holding it, frozen as it was, above and out of running water when found.

I think Zolo, hurt and helpless for himself and others, got as far as getting the notebook and pencil in hand before the cold paralyzed him and put him to sleep.

He thinks," I'll tell the world what happened here, but I can not bring pencil to paper, but they will see I died trying."

[Ziljoe]

So many questions!!!!!

The ravine was filled over time with blown in and precipitated snowfall. At the depth they were found, the overburden was considerable.

It must have been clear of snow to ground level at the the ravine at the time of the incident or a snow cave had already formed above the stream bed .

Things I can't formulate an hypothetical answer for ,why are their heads all in the direct flow of the water if the stream? , it is not somewhere to lie or wait out the weather.

I have a tough time contemplating Lyuda being injured and leaning against the ledge for breath while Zolo is trying to write something on a notepad. I would think he would make an attempt at rescue.

Yes and no, I suppose it depends on when the injuries took place , it would be logical to jump to the conclusion that all the injuries took place in the ravine at the same time.however, If the injuries happened at the ceder or the tent then there might be some argument to temporarily place the ravine 4 where they were found .

If Zolotaryov is writing anything, this may suggest that it is not dark at that moment in time?

I'm not sure how much of the bodies were frozen when found. They are reported to be decaying but that may just be the parts submerged in the stream.

It looks like the ravine 4 were dragged on these ski sledge's too, given the nature of the very shallow height of this sleigh from the ground, I can only imagine a few bumps and scrapes as the bodies are dragged .

I think Zolo, hurt and helpless for himself and others, got as far as getting the notebook and pencil in hand before the cold paralyzed him and put him to sleep.

If there was a pen and notebook I think they were in his hands before his rib injury? I just can't see him moving.

[SURI]

They fell in pairs when they were walking behind each other, therefore they ended up with their heads in the same position and were next to each other. At that moment, Zolotaryov certainly didn't want to write anything. One of the pair carried and led the other, which is why only two have broken ribs and two do not. Tibo carried Dubinina on his back, and Zolotaryov led Kolevatov.

[GlennM]

I do not know if it is or was common practice,  but Zolo carries how nany cameras? Does each hiker keep an individual diary as evidence of their efforts? If this is true, then was there any need for Zolo to have yet another notebook? I have no clear sense from his biography on Dyatlov Pass.com that he was in the habit of using a notepad.

If Zolo was found with writing materials in hand, I believe that hypothermia preceded getting the notepad. Death followed, and then  post morten compression and crush. We know how the bodies appeared when found. Do we also think that the clock stopped for all at the same time and they succumbed simultaneously ? Is there any real reason to believe Zolo and Lyuda's injuries had the same cause?

[SURI]

That's why Dubinina also has her arms outstretched, as she held Tibo by the neck and fell onto her back and Tibo on top of her.

[SURI]

If Zolo was found with writing materials in hand, I believe that hypothermia preceded getting the notepad. Death followed, and then  post morten compression and crush. We know how the bodies appeared when found. Do we also think that the clock stopped for all at the same time and they succumbed simultaneously ? Is there any real reason to believe Zolo and Lyuda's injuries had the same cause?

I have no doubt that the cause of the injuries to those 4 is the same. If you believe that Zolo was crushed post mortem, why wasn't Kolevatov also crushed when he lay next to him?

[Ziljoe]

I am unclear on how many cameras zolotaryov had but it seems to be one but inThe tent in zoloz back pack.. I can not for the life of me remember if it was fact that there was a camera at the ravine or just the camera case . I believe the story about a note pad was 59 years later . This adds to the confusion of other people's poor memory or those that get pleasure from adding bits of mystery into the story as legitimate and that's a problem for me. 

From trying to find a simple cause , I would suggest that the injuries happened to the ravine 4 at the same time and perhaps the other 5 were with them when tragedy happened.

Or as suggested, it is a later injury after death but I think there's some controversy with the autopsy report that this couldn't of happened. I think things like frostbite are missing which suggests the ravine 4 died first and before the others.

I will try pictures but my tools....and skills are limited. I could be wrong about the locations.

[Ziljoe]

This is how I understand the location to be.
( I might be wrong).

Green points to the ceder area and the path of  derby of clothes and twigs .

Blue with dashes is the flooring of the den.

Red is the location of the ravine 4 in the stream.

Yellow towards 1079 and the tent.










If the ravine was empty empty enough to allow a person to lie long ways across the stream it tells us something of the amount of snow at the stream bed , it either wasn't there at the time, they perhaps dug some snow out of a cornice with their feet , or there was a snow bridge /cave .

This is to try and give an example of a snow cave over the running stream . It may have been much smaller when the ravine four or all the hikers found it. When widening the hole , it would definitely weaken the natural nature structure made through the season, similarly some could have fallen through or they just dug to much in to the side.

What do know and can see is that snow gathered there in the winter of 1958-59 to a high level, more than insiders or outsiders could dig or shovel. The ravine must have either been empty to the stream bed on that day or they stream bed was covered with space underneath .

[OLD JEDI 72]

One of those cutouts was dug to accommodate Lydia's corpse after the fact. Apparently. Or so I was told.

[Ziljoe]

One of those cutouts was dug to accommodate Lydia's corpse after the fact. Apparently. Or so I was told.

I believe it was the purple area in this photo. I did read it somewhere too. A lot of snow certainly filled the ravine at some point. It's quite refreshing to be able say something as a fact .