Where’s the tongue?

[Blkdahlia]

Just curious on everyone’s thoughts about the missing tongue of Dubinina.
The autopsy report said the tongue was missing. There was no explanation.

[Loose}{Cannon]

Rotten away while face down in a stream of water.

[Blkdahlia]

Rotten away while face down in a stream of water.

That’s one possibility. Thibeaux, Kolevatov, and Zolotaryov were also face down in a stream of water but they managed to still have their tongues. 
I just assumed that since my tongue survives in saliva every day, it might have the ability to survive in running water.

That was one of the things that stood out to me about this case. Dubinina’s tongue was gone.
From what I have read most conclude it was the result of her mouth being open under running water.

Wonder how long that water had been flowing like that under so much compressed snow?

I found the position that she died in to be baffling. On her knees face down in the waterflow, covered in snow. Not a position or place one would choose to die in nor would a friend place one in.

What do I know? I just feel so bad for these kids. They deserve a proper investigation with investigators having compassion and dedication for the truth.

[Loose}{Cannon]

I just assumed that since my tongue survives in saliva every day, it might have the ability to survive in running water

Your tongue is alive and otherwise not rotten.   Lol

On her knees face down in the waterflow

Which is unlike the other three.

[Blkdahlia]

I just assumed that since my tongue survives in saliva every day, it might have the ability to survive in running water

Your tongue is alive and otherwise not rotten.   Lol

On her knees face down in the waterflow

Which is unlike the other three.

Absolutely correct! This is no ordinary living tongue. What do you think about the blood found in her stomach?

[CyberShell]

That could have been from the massive haemorrhage Lyudmila had in her heart's right atrium.

[Blkdahlia]

Oh wow. I never thought of that.

[Blkdahlia]

Am I the only person who has considered she bit it off or it was cut off by an attacker?

[Loose}{Cannon]

http://forum.dyatlovpass.com/index.php?topic=27.0

Diaphragm of mouth and tongue absent

Absolutely nothing about being cut, severed, bitten, chopped etc. The entire lining of the mouth and tongue was absent....thats it.

The stomach contained up to 100 cm3 of mucous mass of a dark reddish color.

The position of the internal organs is correct, in the pleural cavities was contained up to one and a half liters of liquid dark blood. The pericardial bag contained up to 20 cm 3 of a yellowish transparent liquid. Heart size 12 x 4 x 5. In the region of the right ventricle of an irregular oval shape, a hemorrhage of 4 x 4 cm, with diffuse impregnation of the right ventricular muscle. The thickness of the left ventricular muscle is 1.4 cm and the right one is 0.5 cm. The right and left half of the heart contained up to 50 cm of liquid dark blood.

[sarapuk]

Dubinina Official Autopsy Report
''The inner surface of the aortic smooth and clean. Light from the surface sinyushnokrasnogo color fluffy to the touch. In the context of lung tissue dark red color when pressed with the cut surface liberally dripping bloody foamy fluid lumen of the bronchi free. The horns of the hyoid bone XXXXXXXX unusual mobility, soft tissue adjacent to the hyoid bone gryaznoserogo color. Aperture mouth and tongue missing. The upper edge of the hyoid bone is exposed. The mucous membrane of the esophagus, trachea bronchi sinyushnokrasnovatogo color. The injuries of the head area of ​​the soft tissue and "skin bath 'limbs are posthumous changes (decay and decomposition) Dubinina corpse, which was recently before finding water.''


Note ; It doesnt state if all the 4 horns of the hyoid bone were subject to unusual mobility. Also what is the  XXXXXXXX  !  ? 

[Loose}{Cannon]

something was crossed out in the report. 

https://dyatlovpass.com/case-files-355-357?rbid=17743

[Blkdahlia]

What in the world does that mean? 

[Morski]

I dont think, that the rav4 bodies were found in a very natural position as well. Anyway, we can presume, that the position of Kolevatov and Zolotoryov kinda makes sense (trying to warm each other). Nikolai was some 30cm downstream (probably been closer to the other two, but separated (naturally or not) at some point. Although, if they died together, or one after another in a reasonably short period of time, given the fact that they were very cold already and that bodies get stiff after death, it is strange, but anyway. 
Dubinina is in the most awklard position. Probably her body was as well closer to the guys, but slipped away downstream to the position in which she was found. Her arms are pointing upwards, she is on her knees. Looks to me, as her body literally slipped, postmortem or in the best case she was nearly dead, with no strenght to move at all. According to the autopsy, everyone from the rav4 died as a result of "act of violence". I am wondering, what is the chance that they were murdered, or at least severely beaten, then left to die, and afterwards their bodies were just thrown on one another, piled up? Than it was a matter of exposure and nature for the decaying process.
As for the missing tongue, it is very odd, that in the autopsy report it is just mentioned as "absent". ("The tongue in the oral cavity is absent. The diaphragm of the mouth and tongue is absent.") She was in a strange possition, mouth open, therefore snow and melted water running through and generally a lot more exposed to elements than the others in the rav, but still strange to entirely lose the tongue, as it was never been there in the first place. In warmer conditions would make more sense, but with all the snow and freezing cold water... Or, the autopsy report is just presented in a clumsy way. 
I dont know why, I keep recalling the Donnie Eichar`s Dead mountain, where he is describing the character of Liuda, and he mentions that it is known that sometimes when irritated, she would show untamed tongue behaviour, IIRC. If true, what a sad irony.   

[Blkdahlia]

She probably did have a mouth on her. In the case of murder, it’s possible she had some things to say so her tongue was removed.

[sarapuk]

I wonder what was crossed out in the report and why ! ! ? ?

[DH106]

She was found with her head down & mouth open in a running steam after her body had been frozen for several months - so it's not really supprising the tounge was missing.
It was likely carried away as the stream began to thaw and running water began to flow - frozen flesh becomes very brittle and likely to break off as it begins to thaw, especially with running water applying a force..

[sarapuk]

We dont know for certain if her body was frozen there for months  ! ? 

''The horns of the hyoid bone XXXXXXXX unusual mobility''

[DH106]

We dont know for certain if her body was frozen there for months  ! ? 

''The horns of the hyoid bone XXXXXXXX unusual mobility''

You have evidence that the body wasn't left in situ?
Otherwise it would be frozen there for several months.

[sarapuk]

MISSING EVIDENCE

[sarapuk]

"According to Henrietta Churkin, a forensic pathologist present at the autopsy: 'When it was discovered that Dubinina had no tongue, we wondered even more. I asked Boris [Vozrozhdenny]: "Where could [the tongue] go?" He shrugged his shoulders. It seemed to me he was depressed and even scared."

[Игорь Б.]

http://1723.ru/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=5133&view=findpost&p=64056

[sarapuk]

;;Although such solid snow is not an obstacle to mice, in search of food they are able to grit concrete in the literal sense of the word, it is more likely that the tongue is frozen in avalanche snow and it was torn off at the moment of the coup and the fall of the body into the water . ;;  This sounds like nonsense to me. Any way its purely speculative.

[sarapuk]

If someone is suggesting that the Dyatlov Group built a Den near the stream and then an avalanche fell on them well that just doesnt make any sense whatsoever.  First of all they are hardly likely to make a Den near a stream.  Secondly the bodies were found in different areas not all at the stream. Thirdly there is no suggestion that an avalanche actually took place and caused death and injury. ETC ETC.

[Игорь Б.]

http://1723.ru/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=5133&view=findpost&p=64055
http://1723.ru/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=5133&view=findpost&p=51210
http://1723.ru/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=5133&view=findpost&p=64622

[sarapuk]

Well there may have been a fall of snow, but by all accounts if that was so it would have been unlikely to have caused the serious injuries on some of the bodies.

[Игорь Б.]

http://1723.ru/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=5133&view=findpost&p=86011
http://1723.ru/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=5133&view=findpost&p=84600

[sarapuk]

 [[  High Altitude Medicine & Biology. 8(1):56-61 · March 2007. 

In avalanche accidents, the significance of major trauma as a cause of morbidity and mortality is controversial. 

 Asphyxia is by far the most important reason for death. The severity of injury was minor or moderate.

Once the avalanche stops, it settles like concrete. Bodily movement is nearly impossible.Statistics show that 93 percent of avalanche victims survive if dug out within 15 minutes. After 45 minutes, only 20 to 30 percent of victims are alive. After two hours, very few people survive. 

Chest trauma was also common. However, the majority of rib and sternum fractures occurred in patients with a history of CPR and were considered as resuscitation associated injuries at autopsy. ]]

PLEASE TAKE NOTE : Re The Dyatlov Group.  According to research carried out on avalanche victims over a considerable time scan and in many varied conditions, it looks like any potential avalanche at the site of the alleged Den area would have been considered a very minor avalanche and therefore it is highly unlikely that the snow would have caused the severe injuries on several of the bodies.




<iframe width="800" height="448" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/bOnBRguDZ1I" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[Игорь Б.]

Никакой лавины не было:
http://1723.ru/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=5133&view=findpost&p=65874

В ручье произошло обрушение снежного укрытия по вине Дубининой:
http://1723.ru/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=5133&view=findpost&p=78905

[sarapuk]

All the various investigations into avalanches suggest that NO AVALANCHES occurred in the vicinity of the Dyatlov Group during their last hours. Also it is HIGHLY UNLIKELY that a fall of snow in the area of the so called Den would have caused the serious injuries on some of the bodies, prior to , during or after their demises. Researches have found that people can survive under heavy snow fall and not suffer any serious injuries, such as were found on some of the Dyatlov Group.

[WAB]

http://1723.ru/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=5133&view=findpost&p=64056

It is a terrible heap of absurd and fables. It is necessary know at least elementary conditions and features of district, snow and a climate of that place where all it occurred.
Otherwise it looks as a deceit of readers of this forum.

If I am not mistaken, I already wrote a post about language in other section
http://forum.dyatlovpass.com/index.php?topic=198.0