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Dyatlov Pass Forum

Author Topic: Specific detail - standing in a line after exiting the tent  (Read 4441 times)

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February 13, 2019, 04:00:28 PM
Reply #30
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Star man

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Maybe they moved as quickly as they could without shoes?
The snow was deep (look at the photos of them digging the base of the tent) so stones wouldn't be a problem. If they were running as fast as possible it should be obvious from the snow as they would have to lift their feet higher in a longer stride. Koptelov speaks of "making grooves" which seems like a slower pace.

Maybe they couldn't run because the snow was deep?

February 14, 2019, 01:23:11 AM
Reply #31
Online

Nigel Evans


Maybe they moved as quickly as they could without shoes?
The snow was deep (look at the photos of them digging the base of the tent) so stones wouldn't be a problem. If they were running as fast as possible it should be obvious from the snow as they would have to lift their feet higher in a longer stride. Koptelov speaks of "making grooves" which seems like a slower pace.

Maybe they couldn't run because the snow was deep?
The footsteps don't indicate deep snow being raised in parts?

February 14, 2019, 04:48:14 AM
Reply #32
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Star man

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Dare I even say this but what if they didn’t run because they thought it might provoke an attack from some kind of wild beast?

E.g if you came face to face with a bear it is not a good idea to immediately run unless you are being chased.  Also if you could you would drop a personal item like your back pack or a piece of clothing to attempt to give the bear a reason to stop and inspect/sniff the item allowing more time for you to escape (Dyatlov jacket)?

February 14, 2019, 05:34:37 AM
Reply #33
Online

Nigel Evans


Dare I even say this but what if they didn’t run because they thought it might provoke an attack from some kind of wild beast?

E.g if you came face to face with a bear it is not a good idea to immediately run unless you are being chased.  Also if you could you would drop a personal item like your back pack or a piece of clothing to attempt to give the bear a reason to stop and inspect/sniff the item allowing more time for you to escape (Dyatlov jacket)?
Why leave all the weapons in the tent?
But the big problem for the wild animal theory is why light a fire?

February 14, 2019, 06:03:50 AM
Reply #34
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Monika


Dare I even say this but what if they didn’t run because they thought it might provoke an attack from some kind of wild beast?

E.g if you came face to face with a bear it is not a good idea to immediately run unless you are being chased.  Also if you could you would drop a personal item like your back pack or a piece of clothing to attempt to give the bear a reason to stop and inspect/sniff the item allowing more time for you to escape (Dyatlov jacket)?

You're right, an organized move without a run could really be explained by a slow retreat before the animal.

But why did not the traces of the animal survive until the traces of the tourists have been preserved, and the animal is much heavier than a person? And why did the meat and sweets remain in the tent intact?

February 14, 2019, 06:17:23 AM
Reply #35
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gypsy


Dare I even say this but what if they didn’t run because they thought it might provoke an attack from some kind of wild beast?

E.g if you came face to face with a bear it is not a good idea to immediately run unless you are being chased.  Also if you could you would drop a personal item like your back pack or a piece of clothing to attempt to give the bear a reason to stop and inspect/sniff the item allowing more time for you to escape (Dyatlov jacket)?

You're right, an organized move without a run could really be explained by a slow retreat before the animal.

But why did not the traces of the animal survive until the traces of the tourists have been preserved, and the animal is much heavier than a person? And why did the meat and sweets remain in the tent intact?

There is no evidence consistent with bear or other animal attack, no footprints, no scratches or bites anywhere on bodies or things around the 3 scenes. I would assume if the investigation found some, the case would be closed immediately.

February 14, 2019, 08:50:54 AM
Reply #36
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Star man

Case-Files Achievement Recipient
Ok, “bear” with me on this. lol2

Let’ say that Semyon spots something while outside and grabs his camera and informs the others in the tent as he does so.  He and some of the others go outside to see without their shoes and weapons.  The beast approaches closer and those outside realise they are in danger and start to slowly move away down the slope.  The beast approaches the tent and starts sniffing around the entrance. Those still inside panic because they are trapped and cut the tent to get out. They then also move down the slope. Dyatlov drops his jacket to divert the animal. They then go down the slope to the cedar where they can climb up if needed or build a fire to keep warm and ward off the animal.

There are no traces because the animal doesn’t follow them or at least not in their own footsteps.  The snow immediately around the tent does covered any tracks in that area.

It doesn’t eat the food in the tent because something startles it. The tent collapses as it pushes its way in and it leaves.

February 14, 2019, 11:26:15 AM
Reply #37
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gypsy


Ok, “bear” with me on this. lol2

Let’ say that Semyon spots something while outside and grabs his camera and informs the others in the tent as he does so.  He and some of the others go outside to see without their shoes and weapons.  The beast approaches closer and those outside realise they are in danger and start to slowly move away down the slope.  The beast approaches the tent and starts sniffing around the entrance. Those still inside panic because they are trapped and cut the tent to get out. They then also move down the slope. Dyatlov drops his jacket to divert the animal. They then go down the slope to the cedar where they can climb up if needed or build a fire to keep warm and ward off the animal.

There are no traces because the animal doesn’t follow them or at least not in their own footsteps.  The snow immediately around the tent does covered any tracks in that area.

It doesn’t eat the food in the tent because something startles it. The tent collapses as it pushes its way in and it leaves.

Nice story, what happened next?

February 14, 2019, 12:08:22 PM
Reply #38
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Star man

Case-Files Achievement Recipient
Ok, “bear” with me on this. lol2

Let’ say that Semyon spots something while outside and grabs his camera and informs the others in the tent as he does so.  He and some of the others go outside to see without their shoes and weapons.  The beast approaches closer and those outside realise they are in danger and start to slowly move away down the slope.  The beast approaches the tent and starts sniffing around the entrance. Those still inside panic because they are trapped and cut the tent to get out. They then also move down the slope. Dyatlov drops his jacket to divert the animal. They then go down the slope to the cedar where they can climb up if needed or build a fire to keep warm and ward off the animal.

There are no traces because the animal doesn’t follow them or at least not in their own footsteps.  The snow immediately around the tent does covered any tracks in that area.

It doesn’t eat the food in the tent because something startles it. The tent collapses as it pushes its way in and it leaves.

Nice story, what happened next?

Let's say the animal starts down the slope after them, so they split up into groups.  Some go to the cedar, some along the slop.

Semyon, Luda! And Thibo walk off a ridge in the darkness and fall 5 metres hence the traumas which they later die from. Rustem falls too but has less damage, but still dies later. The others die of hypothermia.  But this time the animal has gone.


February 14, 2019, 02:22:39 PM
Reply #39
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sarapuk

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Dare I even say this but what if they didn’t run because they thought it might provoke an attack from some kind of wild beast?

E.g if you came face to face with a bear it is not a good idea to immediately run unless you are being chased.  Also if you could you would drop a personal item like your back pack or a piece of clothing to attempt to give the bear a reason to stop and inspect/sniff the item allowing more time for you to escape (Dyatlov jacket)?

A BEAR attack was one of my first thoughts on hearing of the Dyatlov incident. But I talked to a Russian friend and he seemed completely against the idea of it being a bear. He knows the area has Bears. You cant out run them and even walking away will get a response ie they will still attack if they are in attack mode.
DB

February 14, 2019, 02:26:18 PM
Reply #40
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sarapuk

Case-Files Achievement Recipient
Ok, “bear” with me on this. lol2

Let’ say that Semyon spots something while outside and grabs his camera and informs the others in the tent as he does so.  He and some of the others go outside to see without their shoes and weapons.  The beast approaches closer and those outside realise they are in danger and start to slowly move away down the slope.  The beast approaches the tent and starts sniffing around the entrance. Those still inside panic because they are trapped and cut the tent to get out. They then also move down the slope. Dyatlov drops his jacket to divert the animal. They then go down the slope to the cedar where they can climb up if needed or build a fire to keep warm and ward off the animal.

There are no traces because the animal doesn’t follow them or at least not in their own footsteps.  The snow immediately around the tent does covered any tracks in that area.

It doesn’t eat the food in the tent because something startles it. The tent collapses as it pushes its way in and it leaves.

If a BEAR has gone to the trouble of going to the Tent then it means business. The Dyatlov group would have been torn to pieces in the area of the Tent.
DB

February 14, 2019, 02:57:11 PM
Reply #41
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Star man

Case-Files Achievement Recipient
Ok, “bear” with me on this. lol2

Let’ say that Semyon spots something while outside and grabs his camera and informs the others in the tent as he does so.  He and some of the others go outside to see without their shoes and weapons.  The beast approaches closer and those outside realise they are in danger and start to slowly move away down the slope.  The beast approaches the tent and starts sniffing around the entrance. Those still inside panic because they are trapped and cut the tent to get out. They then also move down the slope. Dyatlov drops his jacket to divert the animal. They then go down the slope to the cedar where they can climb up if needed or build a fire to keep warm and ward off the animal.

There are no traces because the animal doesn’t follow them or at least not in their own footsteps.  The snow immediately around the tent does covered any tracks in that area.

It doesn’t eat the food in the tent because something startles it. The tent collapses as it pushes its way in and it leaves.

If a BEAR has gone to the trouble of going to the Tent then it means business. The Dyatlov group would have been torn to pieces in the area of the Tent.

Ah!  I never said I thought it was a bear.  I was simply using the bear as an analogy for how people would retreat from a wild animal.  I said it was a beast.  An animal.  Bears were probably hibernating.

February 14, 2019, 03:08:51 PM
Reply #42
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sarapuk

Case-Files Achievement Recipient
Ok, “bear” with me on this. lol2

Let’ say that Semyon spots something while outside and grabs his camera and informs the others in the tent as he does so.  He and some of the others go outside to see without their shoes and weapons.  The beast approaches closer and those outside realise they are in danger and start to slowly move away down the slope.  The beast approaches the tent and starts sniffing around the entrance. Those still inside panic because they are trapped and cut the tent to get out. They then also move down the slope. Dyatlov drops his jacket to divert the animal. They then go down the slope to the cedar where they can climb up if needed or build a fire to keep warm and ward off the animal.

There are no traces because the animal doesn’t follow them or at least not in their own footsteps.  The snow immediately around the tent does covered any tracks in that area.

It doesn’t eat the food in the tent because something startles it. The tent collapses as it pushes its way in and it leaves.

If a BEAR has gone to the trouble of going to the Tent then it means business. The Dyatlov group would have been torn to pieces in the area of the Tent.

Ah!  I never said I thought it was a bear.  I was simply using the bear as an analogy for how people would retreat from a wild animal.  I said it was a beast.  An animal.  Bears were probably hibernating.

Well the BEAST that first came to my mind was a BEAR. But I suppose a YETI could be classed as a BEAST, if it existed of course.
DB

February 14, 2019, 03:47:06 PM
Reply #43
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Star man

Case-Files Achievement Recipient
Ok, “bear” with me on this. lol2

Let’ say that Semyon spots something while outside and grabs his camera and informs the others in the tent as he does so.  He and some of the others go outside to see without their shoes and weapons.  The beast approaches closer and those outside realise they are in danger and start to slowly move away down the slope.  The beast approaches the tent and starts sniffing around the entrance. Those still inside panic because they are trapped and cut the tent to get out. They then also move down the slope. Dyatlov drops his jacket to divert the animal. They then go down the slope to the cedar where they can climb up if needed or build a fire to keep warm and ward off the animal.

There are no traces because the animal doesn’t follow them or at least not in their own footsteps.  The snow immediately around the tent does covered any tracks in that area.

It doesn’t eat the food in the tent because something startles it. The tent collapses as it pushes its way in and it leaves.

If a BEAR has gone to the trouble of going to the Tent then it means business. The Dyatlov group would have been torn to pieces in the area of the Tent.

Ah!  I never said I thought it was a bear.  I was simply using the bear as an analogy for how people would retreat from a wild animal.  I said it was a beast.  An animal.  Bears were probably hibernating.

Well the BEAST that first came to my mind was a BEAR. But I suppose a YETI could be classed as a BEAST, if it existed of course.

I know you like the Yeti idea.  grin1  You might be interested to know then that the injuries although being totally consistent with a fall, are also totally consistent with a person being picked up and physically thrown.

February 15, 2019, 01:00:11 PM
Reply #44
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sarapuk

Case-Files Achievement Recipient
Ok, “bear” with me on this. lol2

Let’ say that Semyon spots something while outside and grabs his camera and informs the others in the tent as he does so.  He and some of the others go outside to see without their shoes and weapons.  The beast approaches closer and those outside realise they are in danger and start to slowly move away down the slope.  The beast approaches the tent and starts sniffing around the entrance. Those still inside panic because they are trapped and cut the tent to get out. They then also move down the slope. Dyatlov drops his jacket to divert the animal. They then go down the slope to the cedar where they can climb up if needed or build a fire to keep warm and ward off the animal.

There are no traces because the animal doesn’t follow them or at least not in their own footsteps.  The snow immediately around the tent does covered any tracks in that area.

It doesn’t eat the food in the tent because something startles it. The tent collapses as it pushes its way in and it leaves.

If a BEAR has gone to the trouble of going to the Tent then it means business. The Dyatlov group would have been torn to pieces in the area of the Tent.

Ah!  I never said I thought it was a bear.  I was simply using the bear as an analogy for how people would retreat from a wild animal.  I said it was a beast.  An animal.  Bears were probably hibernating.

Well the BEAST that first came to my mind was a BEAR. But I suppose a YETI could be classed as a BEAST, if it existed of course.

I know you like the Yeti idea.  grin1  You might be interested to know then that the injuries although being totally consistent with a fall, are also totally consistent with a person being picked up and physically thrown.

I like the FACTS. The injuries to DUBININA could not have been caused by another person.
DB

February 15, 2019, 03:38:17 PM
Reply #45
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Star man

Case-Files Achievement Recipient
Ok, “bear” with me on this. lol2

Let’ say that Semyon spots something while outside and grabs his camera and informs the others in the tent as he does so.  He and some of the others go outside to see without their shoes and weapons.  The beast approaches closer and those outside realise they are in danger and start to slowly move away down the slope.  The beast approaches the tent and starts sniffing around the entrance. Those still inside panic because they are trapped and cut the tent to get out. They then also move down the slope. Dyatlov drops his jacket to divert the animal. They then go down the slope to the cedar where they can climb up if needed or build a fire to keep warm and ward off the animal.

There are no traces because the animal doesn’t follow them or at least not in their own footsteps.  The snow immediately around the tent does covered any tracks in that area.

It doesn’t eat the food in the tent because something startles it. The tent collapses as it pushes its way in and it leaves.

If a BEAR has gone to the trouble of going to the Tent then it means business. The Dyatlov group would have been torn to pieces in the area of the Tent.

Ah!  I never said I thought it was a bear.  I was simply using the bear as an analogy for how people would retreat from a wild animal.  I said it was a beast.  An animal.  Bears were probably hibernating.

Well the BEAST that first came to my mind was a BEAR. But I suppose a YETI could be classed as a BEAST, if it existed of course.

I know you like the Yeti idea.  grin1  You might be interested to know then that the injuries although being totally consistent with a fall, are also totally consistent with a person being picked up and physically thrown.

I like the FACTS. The injuries to DUBININA could not have been caused by another person.

You are right about that.  It could not have been caused by another human, unless that human had hands the size of shovels and they could use those hands to hit them at a speed in the range of 260 miles per hour.  Even then you would expect to see another set of secondary injuries, because they would be knocked (theoretically up to 50 metres horizontally) - realistically maybe between 10 to 20 metres.

February 16, 2019, 01:54:30 PM
Reply #46
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sarapuk

Case-Files Achievement Recipient
Ok, “bear” with me on this. lol2

Let’ say that Semyon spots something while outside and grabs his camera and informs the others in the tent as he does so.  He and some of the others go outside to see without their shoes and weapons.  The beast approaches closer and those outside realise they are in danger and start to slowly move away down the slope.  The beast approaches the tent and starts sniffing around the entrance. Those still inside panic because they are trapped and cut the tent to get out. They then also move down the slope. Dyatlov drops his jacket to divert the animal. They then go down the slope to the cedar where they can climb up if needed or build a fire to keep warm and ward off the animal.

There are no traces because the animal doesn’t follow them or at least not in their own footsteps.  The snow immediately around the tent does covered any tracks in that area.

It doesn’t eat the food in the tent because something startles it. The tent collapses as it pushes its way in and it leaves.

If a BEAR has gone to the trouble of going to the Tent then it means business. The Dyatlov group would have been torn to pieces in the area of the Tent.

Ah!  I never said I thought it was a bear.  I was simply using the bear as an analogy for how people would retreat from a wild animal.  I said it was a beast.  An animal.  Bears were probably hibernating.

Well the BEAST that first came to my mind was a BEAR. But I suppose a YETI could be classed as a BEAST, if it existed of course.

I know you like the Yeti idea.  grin1  You might be interested to know then that the injuries although being totally consistent with a fall, are also totally consistent with a person being picked up and physically thrown.

I like the FACTS. The injuries to DUBININA could not have been caused by another person.

You are right about that.  It could not have been caused by another human, unless that human had hands the size of shovels and they could use those hands to hit them at a speed in the range of 260 miles per hour.  Even then you would expect to see another set of secondary injuries, because they would be knocked (theoretically up to 50 metres horizontally) - realistically maybe between 10 to 20 metres.


I think we are all doing the right thing by hammering out the possibilities.  Going over things from different angles etc will eventually bring positive results Iam sure. For instance the MYSTERIOUS INJURIES to DUBININA are mysterious there is no doubt about that, despite some people trying to find a RATIONAL EXPLANATION. But we may be dealing with something irrational, something that we dont understand, a phenomenon, even something alien to our our known existence.
DB

February 17, 2019, 01:09:52 AM
Reply #47
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Star man

Case-Files Achievement Recipient
Ok, “bear” with me on this. lol2

Let’ say that Semyon spots something while outside and grabs his camera and informs the others in the tent as he does so.  He and some of the others go outside to see without their shoes and weapons.  The beast approaches closer and those outside realise they are in danger and start to slowly move away down the slope.  The beast approaches the tent and starts sniffing around the entrance. Those still inside panic because they are trapped and cut the tent to get out. They then also move down the slope. Dyatlov drops his jacket to divert the animal. They then go down the slope to the cedar where they can climb up if needed or build a fire to keep warm and ward off the animal.

There are no traces because the animal doesn’t follow them or at least not in their own footsteps.  The snow immediately around the tent does covered any tracks in that area.

It doesn’t eat the food in the tent because something startles it. The tent collapses as it pushes its way in and it leaves.

If a BEAR has gone to the trouble of going to the Tent then it means business. The Dyatlov group would have been torn to pieces in the area of the Tent.

Ah!  I never said I thought it was a bear.  I was simply using the bear as an analogy for how people would retreat from a wild animal.  I said it was a beast.  An animal.  Bears were probably hibernating.

Well the BEAST that first came to my mind was a BEAR. But I suppose a YETI could be classed as a BEAST, if it existed of course.

I know you like the Yeti idea.  grin1  You might be interested to know then that the injuries although being totally consistent with a fall, are also totally consistent with a person being picked up and physically thrown.

I like the FACTS. The injuries to DUBININA could not have been caused by another person.

You are right about that.  It could not have been caused by another human, unless that human had hands the size of shovels and they could use those hands to hit them at a speed in the range of 260 miles per hour.  Even then you would expect to see another set of secondary injuries, because they would be knocked (theoretically up to 50 metres horizontally) - realistically maybe between 10 to 20 metres.


I think we are all doing the right thing by hammering out the possibilities.  Going over things from different angles etc will eventually bring positive results Iam sure. For instance the MYSTERIOUS INJURIES to DUBININA are mysterious there is no doubt about that, despite some people trying to find a RATIONAL EXPLANATION. But we may be dealing with something irrational, something that we dont understand, a phenomenon, even something alien to our our known existence.

Yes I think we have to continuously test our ideas.