rotten cedar

[Osi]

You can camp in the forests hundreds of times, but the adventurous spirit in people tends to do more extreme things. For example, spending the night on a bare hill. I have no doubt that Dyatlov's team also decided to try this. However, it would be unreasonable to think of spending the night with a few logs in the stove. While passing Kholat, it was decided to set up a tent on that ridge with a sudden decision. The weather was slowly starting to deteriorate. But there was not enough wood to last until the morning. While 5 people were preparing the tent, 4 people would bring dry wood from the forest border. Tibo, Semyon, Liyutmila and the 4th person, not sure who was Rustem or Kolovatov, went down to the forest. They descended easily, without bags or batons. I have always accepted the scenario that has developed so far for 10 years. But I couldn't be sure what might have happened to the four people who landed in the forest. After Tedy's plausible evidence about the fallen cedar tree, my logic began to settle. I think they were injured when a tree fell into the forest. The tree did not fall on the tent. The tent was 1 mile away on the ridge. I watched dozens of videos on YouTube about a tree falling down. They easily fall over when the wind blows 30-40 km/h. Perhaps the cause of the rotten and dry cedar toppling over was caused by a person trying to climb on it. Then someone ran towards the tent and called for help.

[GlennM]

Osi, if I understand you correctly, a wood gathering party ran into trouble a mile away from their tent. There was insufficient firewood at the tent. The remaining tourists went to their aid. None could return to the tent. The cause of the entire tragedy is a single rotten cedar tree which fell upon unsuspecting victims. All that remains is to address the issue of footwear.

[Axelrod]

I heard approximately the same story, which was told about the Dyatlov group for more than an hour by the Orthodox priest Leonid Glebets in a cassock with a cross, that they went to collect firewood away from the tent. So you're not the first with this idea. Unfortunately, his channel has been deleted, I don’t remember the script well and cannot compare the details.

[Osi]

I have never come across the story of the priest you mentioned. The first message I wrote to the forum a year ago was about the group being split into two. Anyone who believes that the tent is set up on the slope should know this; The most important need that night is fuel. Because the night temperature on the slope was -30 degrees. There wasn't enough wood in the tent inventory to get through that night without freezing. If the tent is not a theater, carrying wood is a must.

[Axelrod]

In English: I doubt the temperature that night was -30*С. I'm guessing this is bad input. Frosty temperatures are needed for them to freeze. And since they froze, it means the temperature was -30*С (or -50*С), that’s the way of thinking. But if they did not freeze, if they died for another reason (say, they were beaten, a meteorite fell, a poisonous rocket, etc.), then it does not need frost. And if frost is not needed, then we don’t need -30*С. And if we don’t need -30*С, then it didn’t happen. And the question arises, where did we get the temperature of -30*С (at least at the hours of their death)? Who told us about this?

That is, the assumption that they froze is also incorrect input data for building a theory. Does he understand my logic? I think like a programmer because my job involves writing computer programs. We have 2 incorrect inputs, and we have what we have. For example, we need to build a graph in Matcad, and we get different graphs from the input data.
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In Russian:  Я сомневаюсь, что температура той ночью была -30*. Я предполагаю, что это неверные входные данные. Морозная температура нужна для того, чтобы они замёрзли. А раз они замёрзли, то значит температура была -30 (или - 50), такой ход мысли. Но если они не замёрзли, если они умерли по другой причине (скажем, их побили, упал метеорит, ядовитая ракета, прочее), то нем не нужен мороз. А если мороз не нужен, то нам не нужно -30*. А если нам не нужно -30*, то значит этого и не было. И возникает вопрос, а откуда мы взяли температуру -30* (по крайней мере, в часы их смерти)? Кто нам об этом сказал?

То есть, предположение, что они замёрзли, это тоже неверные входные данные для построения теории. Понимает мою логику? Я рассуждаю как программист, потому что моя работа связана с написанием компьютерных программ. Мы имеем 2 неверных входных данных, и мы имеет то что имеем. Например, надо построит график а Matcad, и мы получаем разные графики от входных данных.

[GlennM]

Do we believe that the day before the tragedy, the tourists had an opportunity at their second to last camp to gather and bring firewood before they made their final camp on 1079? Does it seem curious that instead of carrying firewood for a day,  it was preferable to have a volunteer team travel two miles, including a one mile return trip,  half of it uphill to do the same thing? Either way, the firewood could be back packed or pulled on a ski sledge to camp. The trace evidence shows no ski tracks going back to camp, which we would expect, since no one returned. Too, there were no ski tracks from the tent to the giant cedar either. I,would expect anyone would prefer to ski downslope though.

[Partorg]

1. In the photo of preparing a site for a tent on a slope, it is clearly visible that the snowstorm (buran) is not over yet. This means that the temperature at that moment should not be lower than –5,  –6 °C
The durabiliti and  longevity of the high footprints indicates that the snow temperature also was not lower than these values.

2. As evidenced by the reports of tourist groups of those years, with close “packing” under common blankets, the temperature environment there was created quite tolerable, so the main problem of spending the night on the slope was not the lack of firewood for the whole night, but the lack of effective thermal insulation of the floor. Those. lack of spruce branches under the tent.

Firewood could not solve this problem, so if they went down for some reason, it would be for spruce branches. But they could not do this for the simple reason that in conditions of a snowstorm and visibility of several tens of meters, separating and diverging to a distance exceeding the limit of visibility would be pure madness, which no group leader would do if he was in right mind.

[Ziljoe]

As I understand it, as Partorg states and others with more knowledge than myself, the raised footprints only occur in certain weather conditions.

The raised footprints ( and lack of other prints/tracks) suggest that there were no outsiders and prior to the tent being pitched, the snow/weather was not in the condition to keep those tracks. My thinking is that there is no raised ski tracks leading to the tent on the slope. I would think that 9 hikers on skis , with back packs , in single file, would leave raised ski tracks also?. Perhaps this did happen but the wind and snow eroded them .

However, again there are no foot prints outside the tent, raised or otherwise , not from setting up the tent, going to the toilet or from the alleged cutting their way out of the tent. ( I think the closest report of foot prints is with in 30m down the slope from the tent).

All this suggests there was temperature change and snow fall from the time of  pitching the tent to the time of exit.

 So why no footprints around the tent at all?

 It could suggest the collapse of a snow slab or small avalanche, enough to compress the snow so that the raised footprints would not occur right outside the tent or for 30 m down slope. That small snow collapse had changed the fresh snow fall.

I also agree that splitting up the group would never be good practice. Perhaps if it was the morning , visibility was perfectly clear but never in poor conditions.

The footprints are a direct link and the type of footprints tells us something about the weather at the time of the footprints being formed.

Could it be possible for outsiders to fake these footprints? .

I don't think so, or not without leaving a pile of their own footprints . Stagers would not know how the footprints would look, theres no way the stagers would know they would be raised? They wouldn't know what would be left behind nor the importance that actual toes would show in the prints. There's too much small detail that stagers couldn't stage to make things fit and there's zero sign of stagers. Nothing.

The only new thought I've had out of this thread is the point about visibility, could it be that Zina, Rustem, Igor and the torch on the slope were using themselves as visual markers for those that had gone to the ravine/ceder?. Was the distance between them dictated by visibility and they did not want to lose the direction back to the tent but we're waiting for the return? ( I know it's a long shot)

[Osi]

It is 1 in the afternoon. The weather is windy (Winds are a sign of rain) and heavy snowfall is expected within 1 hour. The temperature is -9 degrees. Semyon and Dyatlov are having a quick discussion about the route. Igor predicts that they will be able to cover 10 km from the kholat ridge, over hard ground, by 5 pm. This is three times the distance that can be covered from the forest border and half the distance to Otorten peak. I think a definite route has been created there. If you move from the ridges, you can reach Otorten in 2 days with only 1 night camping. If you go down to the forest, it means 5 days and 5 nights camping, which is an unacceptable waste of time. Snowfall occurs between -4 and -20 degrees. soft and mushy snow at low temperatures - hard icy snow after 10 degrees. The group climbs the ridge and is exposed to a blizzard. Only 7 kilometers of the targeted 10 km road could be covered. There is an advantage of 1.5 hours of light to set up the tent at 5 pm. 5 people will set up the tent, 4 people will go down to the forest border without backpacks and bring dry wood. Each person should bring 5 dry cedar branches with a diameter of 3-4 cm that can be broken with the knee. . I don't think anyone should claim that the night temperature in the tent's location could be below -20 degrees at the beginning of February. It doesn't seem possible to insulate a tent without a stove in that heat (even with dry blankets). - Even if you provide this insulation at the default temperature of 25-28 degrees, the temperature the body will be exposed to will be - 15 degrees, which means being exposed to hypothermia in the first half hour.

[GlennM]

I too support the idea that the group camped on 1079 to expedite their circuit of Otorten. I find it diffucult to think that 9 people with food and a tent could not survive one night without either fire of spruce branches. I believe the tent is most important for their immediate needs because it is a shelters from wind and snow. I think the hikers could remain in heavy clothes or alternately move together for mutual warmth.

They left the tent from necessity or voluntarily. If voluntary,  they subsequently could not get back in. If escaping imminent or actual danger, then its from necessity, the supplies inside being unavailable. I am suspicious of the idea they cut their way out. I like the idea a slab slip precipitated their actions. All else was a consequence of not being able to immediately get in the tent again.

[Partorg]

So why no footprints around the tent at all?

There were no traces left in the immediate vicinity of the tent, possibly because the landslide that hit the tent and the surrounding area consisted mainly of deep (or surface) frost, which is  Ice crumbs in appearance and mechanical properties similar to sugar or coarse salt
There are no traces left in it at all - you pull out your leg, which is immersed almost to the knee, and not even a small pit is visible in this place. In addition, it does not compress when a landslide stops like ordinary snow, does not cake at sub-zero temperatures and is easily carried by wind ≥ 8 m/s.  At the time the tent was discovered, this mass had long since been scattered all around, and in its place lay the usual fine snow blown in by blizzards.

could it be that Zina, Rustem, Igor and the torch on the slope were using themselves as visual markers for those that had gone to the ravine/ceder?

They went to the tent when the storm ended and the wind died down a little, although it became cold. Went hoping to dig up at least a sheet at the entrance to cover the snow shelter or build a windbreak. But the glycogen  reserves were already used up, they walked on “autopilot” - not noticing anything around, and fell where the general hypothermia put an end to it.

[Ziljoe]

So why no footprints around the tent at all?

There were no traces left in the immediate vicinity of the tent, possibly because the landslide that hit the tent and the surrounding area consisted mainly of deep (or surface) frost, which is  Ice crumbs in appearance and mechanical properties similar to sugar or coarse salt
There are no traces left in it at all - you pull out your leg, which is immersed almost to the knee, and not even a small pit is visible in this place. In addition, it does not compress when a landslide stops like ordinary snow, does not cake at sub-zero temperatures and is easily carried by wind ≥ 8 m/s.  At the time the tent was discovered, it had long since been scattered all around, and in its place lay the usual fine snow blown in by blizzards.

could it be that Zina, Rustem, Igor and the torch on the slope were using themselves as visual markers for those that had gone to the ravine/ceder?

They went to the tent when the storm ended and the wind died down a little, although it became cold. Went hoping to dig up at least a sheet at the entrance to cover the snow shelter or build a windbreak. But the glycogen  reserves were already used up, they walked on “autopilot” - not noticing anything around, and fell where the general hypothermia put an end to it.

I tend to agree with you Partorg, the reason I pose the question  about no foot prints around the tent, is in trying to work out how any stagers would deal with covering their own tracks/prints and then ,somehow make it work that the only footprints left, are of the 9 hikers going down the slope.

I think it is quite unlikely that any stagers could have controlled, manipulated or understood that they would leave the perfect depiction of the hikers leaving the tent. There are just too many variables in my opinion.

I don't think stagers could have erased all of their own footprints in the special conditions for the snow for raised prints that we are left with. It is a very unique outcome and seems specific to the weather conditions of that day or night of the incident.

I also think it is most likely that they were trying to return to the tent. If they had survived the night , there was no other option but to try and retrieve the resources at the tent. It is similar to the teacher from the UK Cairngorms incident where she left others behind and crawled on hands and knees in a storm to try and get help. By pure luck, she was spotted.

[GlennM]

I agree that staging is an unlikely possibility. Really, there is nothing to be gained from it. There was no message to send, no audience to receive. À more likely possibility is that the tent was abandoned. We may never know why, but we may determine how. Similarly, we may never know why Igor and others were trying to regain it, but we may understand how.

[Arjan]

Let's assume that all group members had left the tent site to the ravine/cedar, with the (obvoius?) intention to return to the tent within one or two hours.

Why?

A few group members to return to the tent site with running water.
Others to spent the night in an improvised emergency bivac made by the re-erected tent on one ski pole (and the other side might also had been re-erected if necessary)
A few others to return to Vizhay/Ivdel

At the tent site had been the skis and skipoles, gear, food and rucksacks for the way back.
Because the tent site had been on the track to the descent to the storage and from there on already made tracks to Vizhay!
It is far easier to travel in already made tracks than to travel without prepared tracks.

Remark: eight group members had been many years trained to solve complex problems in a rational manner and Semyon had been a survivor since almost two decades (not easy during the Great War and during the Stalin-age after the Great War!).

Fatal events had caused that non of the group members had been able to return from the ravine to the tent site

[Ziljoe]

.

Fatal events had caused that non of the group members had been able to return from the ravine to the tent site

 The majority of us would agree with your statement.

However , the fallen ceder is an interesting new dynamic whatever we all might think, it is extremely coincidental that the rings fit into that time frame. I believe the OP was giving a possible scenario of how the fallen tree came into play for the injuries whilst the tent was originally pitched on the slope. It is food for thought.

In the diary on the 31st of January, Igor writes

We gradually leave the Auspiya valley, it’s upwards all the way but goes rather smoothly. Thin birch grove replaces firs. The end of forest is getting closer. Wind is western, warm, piercing, with speed like the draft from airplanes at take-off. Firn, open spaces. I can't even think of setting up storage here. It's nearly 4. Have to start looking for a place to pitch the tent. We go south in the Auspiya valley. Seems this place has the deepest snow. Wind not strong, snow 1.2-2 m (3-4 ft) deep. We’re exhausted, but start setting up for the night. Firewood is scarce, mostly damp firs. We build the campfire on the logs, too tired to dig a fire pit. Dinner’s in the tent. Nice and warm. Can’t imagine such comfort on the ridge, with howling wind outside, hundreds of kilometers away from human settlements

My interpretation of this final entry is Igor was considering making the labaz around 4 pm.  He concludes that the location he finds himself is not ideal for the labaz or the tent and back tracks to "find" deeper snow for the labaz.

He is grateful for the warmth and luxury of the tent and shares his thoughts of what it would be like to camp on the ridge.
"Can’t imagine such comfort on the ridge, with howling wind outside, hundreds of kilometers away from human settlements"

Why write that statement about comfort on the ridge unless he intends to camp there at some point?. The short distance travelled the following day , still leaves me perplexed.....

[GlennM]

If the original plan was to establish the labaz on the ridge, it was not suitable. They backtrack and create one. Then with what must have been a late start, they get as far as their final camp on 1079. They intend to round Ortoten and camp by the lake. Then, a push back to the labaz and 40 miles to Vishay and home.

Igor mentions warm wind, the strength of a propeller blast. If the conditions were similar their final day, then they pitched their tent on an exposed windy ridge. The warm temperature and blowing snow buildup on the windward side of the tent may have precipitated the slab slip. When that happened, digging the tent out was deemed not an option because more snow would replace that which was excavated. Time to leave.

With the tent down, they could make for boot rock, the labaz or the woods. The woods means fire and shelter and line of sight back to the tent, even if it was covered to a degree. I think that if this happened at night, they underestimated the distance to the treeline and they underestimated the obstacles in their path, both critical.

[Ziljoe]

Hi Glenn, I wasn't thinking that the labaz was going to be established on the ridge, it was more about Igor comparing where he was at that moment in time and then thinking about how it would be on the ridge, as if it was a plan to do so at some point in the future.

I don't know if it's translation but the diary entry is written like speaking in to a dictaphone or was written in short bits at each moment?. If that makes sense?. , It's like a small sentence , take diary out , write another sentence , put diary back in pocket and so on. Surely write the diary at the end of the night in the tent , then mention the day's events ? 

I think this is the Russian version translated by my device from the website, it's a bit different but reads better, as if it's written at the end of the day.

We gradually separate from Auspiya, the climb is continuous, but quite smooth. And then the spruce trees ran out, a rare birch forest began to grow. We reached the border of the forest. The wind is western, warm, piercing, the wind speed is similar to the speed of air when an airplane takes off. Nast, bare places. You don’t even have to think about setting up a warehouse. About 4 hours. You need to choose an overnight stay. We descend south into the Auspiya valley. This is apparently the snowiest place. Light wind on snow 1.2-2 m thick. Tired, exhausted, they set about arranging for the night. There is not enough firewood. Weak, raw spruce. The fire was lit on logs; there was no desire to dig a hole. We have dinner right in the tent. Warm. It is difficult to imagine such comfort somewhere on a ridge, with a piercing howl of the wind, hundreds of kilometers from populated areas.

The translation is different which is a pain..

We gradually leave the Auspiya valley, it’s upwards all the way but goes rather smoothly. Thin birch grove replaces firs. The end of forest is getting closer. Wind is western, warm, piercing, with speed like the draft from airplanes at take-off. Firn, open spaces. I can't even think of setting up storage here. It's nearly 4. Have to start looking for a place to pitch the tent. We go south in the Auspiya valley. Seems this place has the deepest snow. Wind not strong, snow 1.2-2 m (3-4 ft) deep. We’re exhausted, but start setting up for the night. Firewood is scarce, mostly damp firs. We build the campfire on the logs, too tired to dig a fire pit. Dinner’s in the tent. Nice and warm. Can’t imagine such comfort on the ridge, with howling wind outside, hundreds of kilometers away from human settlements

If any russian speaking  members can give a better or exact translation I would be grateful)

[Partorg]

If any russian speaking  members can give a better or exact translation I would be grateful)

Without fluent English, it is hardly possible to determine how much the reverse translation (from English into Russian) exactly corresponds to the English text. But having run the two proposed options through three different translators (with word-by-word analysis of some phrases), we can say with a high degree of confidence that the first (top) option is almost completely identical to the Russian original. The second one is quite accurate from a factual point of view, but rather tongue-tied in the Russian presentation

My interpretation of this final entry is Igor was considering making the labaz around 4 pm.  He concludes that the location he finds himself is not ideal for the labaz or the tent and back tracks to "find" deeper snow for the labaz.

The storage shed (labáz)  in the “classic” form is located on trees. In the most primitive version, this is a pole placed like the crossbar of a football goal in the fork of the branches of two closely spaced trees, in the middle of which a bag is suspended on a rope with something that you can't give be eaten by four-legged.    IMHO, this is what they initially wanted to do. Therefore, the tundra zone with dwarf birches did not suit them. But the next day for some reason they decided to simply bury the extra supplies in the snow.

Why write that statement about comfort on the ridge unless he intends to camp there at some point?. The short distance travelled the following day , still leaves me perplexed.....

I think that's what he intended.  The point of spending the night on the ridge is to avoid wasting your strength at the beginning of the journey in a grueling climb.

[Ziljoe]

Why write that statement about comfort on the ridge unless he intends to camp there at some point?. The short distance travelled the following day , still leaves me perplexed.....

I think that's what he intended.  The point of spending the night on the ridge is to avoid wasting your strength at the beginning of the journey in a grueling climb.

It makes sense. They write they were already exhausted. Although it looks like an easy walk in the summer, in winter with skis and back packs it will be a different. They may have had to walk some of the slope , I'm not sure if the intial incline would be too steep. 

[GlennM]

Caching at Boot Rock seems more prudent to me.

[Ziljoe]

Caching at Boot Rock seems more prudent to me.

My only thought on that is there's nowhere to protect the items. Exposed to high winds, no deep snow. Can't be buried or left high.

[GlennM]

The hikers obviously must have thought the same thing, opting not to use the rocky landmark. It was a somewhat costly decision to backtrack, losing a day and using the provisions.

 It is clear to me if they actually intended to camp by the cedar and not on the ridge, the cache would certainly been left somewhere near the big tree. Alternately, if they were set on keeping to  high ground and were beaten back by the weather , they could have made for the shelter of the forest and cached there. So, they did not leave their reserves by the cedar by choice, nor circumstance. The upshot of this is I feel their past camp was exactly where the tent was found and that was the expedition plan all along.

[Почемучка]

Им совершенно очевидно - помешали не погодные условия: перевалить в первый же раз. Им - мешал груз в рюкзаках. Который они не нашли возможности спрятать - тут же и устроенный лабаз. "Наст. Голые места." - это значит не в чем строить лабаз. Поэтому группа принимает решение сбрасывать груз там, где была предыдущая стоянка.

It is quite obvious that it was not the weather conditions that prevented them from crossing the river the first time. They were hampered by the load in their backpacks. Which they did not find a way to hide - a storage shed was also built right there. "Present. Bare places." - this means there is nothing to build a storage shed in. Therefore, the group decides to dump the cargo where the previous stop was.

[GlennM]

I understand and agree. The intention was to unburden themselves of extra weight. This was done at a location where the supplies could be protected.

Then, after being free from extra weight, the tourists have a choice. The choice is either to go over the ridge onto 1079 and keep to the high ground or instead,  go over the ridge on 1079 and go down to the valley where the cedar is. We find the tent on the high ground and the bodies below in the valley. Since the tent can not move itself, it is clear the team intended to stay to the high ground.

This explains the tent, but not why they left it. Sigh!

[Почемучка]

I understand and agree. The intention was to unburden themselves of extra weight. This was done at a location where the supplies could be protected.

Then, after being free from extra weight, the tourists have a choice. The choice is either to go over the ridge onto 1079 and keep to the high ground or instead,  go over the ridge on 1079 and go down to the valley where the cedar is. We find the tent on the high ground and the bodies below in the valley. Since the tent can not move itself, it is clear the team intended to stay to the high ground.

This explains the tent, but not why they left it. Sigh!

Пока я отсутствовала здесь - я провела кое-какие исследования. В результате которых - я убедилась что и лавина или снежная доска были невозможными причинами. Снега было мало. Склон был такой практически везде - как он описан в дневнике "Наст. Голые места". Разведчики от группы пробежав вперед - не обнаружили снега под постройку лабаза. Конструкция должна быть в виде ямы - по планам туристов.

Из всех природных воздействий - остается подходящей версия Борзенкова или еще могла бы быть шаровая молния. Причастность любых людей к гибели туристов - я отношу к дурацким фантазиям. Кедр - тоже не виноват. Это абсолютно однозначно выяснила.

Инфразвук замечательно объясняет - что туристы перестали себя вести адекватно и могли бежать от наводимого инфразвуком ужаса. Таких наблюдений там оказалось - у свидетелей даже в уголовном деле. А шаровая молния понятно поясняет - почему из палатки ушли с тем что на них было. Не пытаясь рыться в палатке, где было складировано много металлических вещей.

Возможность шаровых молний - объясняется обнаруженной Алексеенковым магнитной аномалии, которая "языком" как раз направлена в сторону установки палатки. Зимняя гроза - не такое уж редкостное из явлений погоды.
Так что на весах - остались только две версии двух известных походников на Перевал Дятлова.
Природа даст знак - какой версии вероятность выше.


While I was away here, I did some research. As a result, I became convinced that an avalanche or a snowboard were impossible causes. There was little snow. The slope was like this almost everywhere - as it is described in the diary “Present Bare Places”. The scouts from the group ran forward and did not find any snow under the storage shed. The structure should be in the form of a pit - according to the plans of tourists.

Of all the natural influences, Borzenkov’s version remains suitable, or it could also be ball lightning. I consider the involvement of any people in the deaths of tourists to be a stupid fantasy. Cedar is not to blame either. I found this out absolutely unambiguously.

Infrasound perfectly explains that tourists stopped behaving adequately and could flee from the horror induced by infrasound. There were such observations there - among witnesses even in a criminal case. And ball lightning clearly explains why they left the tent with what they had on. Without trying to rummage through the tent, where a lot of metal things were stored.

The possibility of ball lightning is explained by the magnetic anomaly discovered by Alekseenkov, whose “tongue” is precisely directed towards the installation of the tent. Winter thunderstorms are not such a rare weather phenomenon.

So on the scales there are only two versions left of two famous hikers to the Dyatlov Pass.

Nature will give a sign - which version is more likely to happen.

[GlennM]

I support your position that rules out hostile human intervention. You favor a natural explanation as do I. Infrasound and ball lightning together might have happened, but do you find that probable? Regarding ball lightning, it is a curious phenonoma. Can we claim there was a shock hazard? We know several tourists had burns, but the usual explanation is fire. Might they think a missile was coming at them? I would run away ( but would probably die anyway).

Infrasound on the other hand would begin to raise fears. Each hiker would have perhaps a different fear. It is true and well documented that group hysteria is a real thing. When fear becomes panic, all the higher mental functions stop. The result is to "freeze" through inaction, run away or blindly fight. We know they took action. There is some physical evidence of the deceased to support an altercation. There is reason to think that in a panic, shoes would not be put on feet. However, I would expect footprints indicative of running. Do you think that snowdrifts covered those running footsteps most near the tent? Could it be that when they came to their senses, they all decided to seek shelter in the woods? If it was darkmand moonless, they may have misjudged the distance to the valley.

[Ziljoe]

I struggle with infrasound . The data or or evidence based practice is extremely low, at least in the west. I don't want to challenge, but I will. I just can't find anything in examples on the internet.

I became aware of ball lighting many years ago but there seems to be nothing , videos etc.

There was experiments done for sound moving a crowd in riots, (tear gas was better).

I am open minded  but I don't know of evidence. We know that within the area of the tent , snow will be at least one meter deep. That's a fact. 

[Partorg]

While I was away here, I did some research. As a result, I became convinced that an avalanche or a snowboard were impossible causes. There was little snow.

I’m embarrassed to ask, as a result of what specific research activities did you come to the conclusion that “there was little snow everywhere there”?  Snow is never the same everywhere. On the upper points of the relief it may sometimes not be present at all, but in the upper third of the leeward slope there is always more of it than on the middle third, and at the foot of it there is more than on the upper and middle thirds combined.. The tent stood on the border of the upper and middle thirds and according to Brusnitsin’s testimony there was 1.5 meters of snow there. The “wrong” tilt of the ski pole to the left of the entrance clearly indicates the vector of force that brought down the tent.  A longitudinal section, and not at the first attempt, indicates that those who cut the tent did this, most likely, lying on their stomachs, being pressed to the floor by the roof with a couple of cubic meters of snow on it, handing over the  knife to the one on the left.
And there are only three factors that could force them to leave the tent and go into the forest in an orderly manner, without signs of panic and loss of control over their actions, in the clothes in which they were later found:  1. A plume of smoke or of gas that covered the tent area and did not disappear for 20 or more minutes; 
2. A few blokes with leaden faces.  armed with firearms;
3. Several cubic meters of “sugar snow”, digging which up with empty hands is like slurping yogurt with a fork.
Everyone (and without any prompting from Mother Nature) can choose the one that seems most real to him.
And if you say that infrasound seems the most real to you, then you will have to explain how people, gripped by horror from the feeling that their head and heart are about to explode, walk in an orderly line in one direction, as if it no infrasound and never has been.

[Почемучка]

I struggle with infrasound . The data or or evidence based practice is extremely low, at least in the west. I don't want to challenge, but I will. I just can't find anything in examples on the internet.

I became aware of ball lighting many years ago but there seems to be nothing , videos etc.

There was experiments done for sound moving a crowd in riots, (tear gas was better).

I am open minded  but I don't know of evidence. We know that within the area of the tent , snow will be at least one meter deep. That's a fact.

https://dyatlovpass.com/case-files-60-61?rbid=17743

Есть и другие свидетельства - содержащие те же самые пояснения по поводу звуков наводящих ужас. В книге "Высшей категории трудности" у писателя Ярового - достаточно много текста именно на эту тему, а он был в первой поисковой команде и писал под диктовку Темпалова - протоколы.

Тема инфразвка - очень удобная в этом смысле. Когда его действие ослабляется: люди приходили в адекватное состояние психики. Всем известны рассказки про морских сирен, что песнями сводили с ума древних мореплавателей. Тогда особо впечатлительных привязывали к мачтам - чтобы в ужасе не кидались  пенные волны. По выходе из точки возникновения и особо громкого инфразвука - люди на кораблях приходили в себя.

There are other testimonies - containing the same explanations about the terrifying sounds. In the book “The Highest Category of Difficulty” the writer Yarovoy has quite a lot of text on this very topic, and he was in the first search team and wrote protocols under Tempalov’s dictation.

The infrasound topic is very convenient in this sense. When its effect weakened: people came to an adequate state of mind. Everyone knows the stories about sea sirens who drove ancient sailors crazy with their songs. Then the especially impressionable were tied to the masts - so that the foam waves would not rush in horror. Upon leaving the point of origin and especially loud infrasound, the people on the ships came to their senses.

[Почемучка]

I’m embarrassed to ask, as a result of what specific research activities did you come to the conclusion that “there was little snow everywhere there”?

Из тех что нам оставили в первую очередь сами участники группы Дятлова. Главный из них я уже озвучила. Постройку лабаза они стали проводить на предыдущем месте стоянки именно потому что дальше по маршруту не нашли где его можно выкопать в виде ямы. Потом я исследовала данные по снежности зим за многие годы и сравнила с тем, что наблюдали попавшие на место событий в эти годы путешественники/туристы. Там ведь не только фотографировали или вели дневники, но и снимали фильмы.

Надо отметить, что зима 1959 года службою метеонаблюдений Свердловска признана одной из самых малоснежных. Эти данные в свободной публикации, так как в России - любят интересовать историей даже в этом плане. Многие ведут личные дневники метеонаблюдений. Этим хобби был славен и Лев Никитич Иванов.

Of those that were left to us, first of all, by the members of the Dyatlov group themselves. I have already voiced the main one. They began to build the storage shed at the previous parking lot precisely because they couldn’t find anywhere further along the route where it could be dug in the form of a hole. Then I examined the data on winter snowfall over many years and compared it with what was observed by travelers/tourists who happened to be on the scene during these years. After all, they not only took photographs or kept diaries there, but also made films.

It should be noted that the winter of 1959 was recognized by the Sverdlovsk weather observation service as one of the least snowy. This data is freely published, because in Russia they like to be interested in history even in this regard. Many people keep long diaries of weather observations. Lev Nikitich Ivanov was also famous for this hobby.