Exploring The Yeti Theory

[Star man]

This a quote from the main site in relation to Thibo’s skull injury:

Vozrozhdenny, who undertook the autopsy, excluded accidental fall on the rock as a possible cause for such a massive and unusual fracture

Thibo’ fracture is decribed as “massive and unusual “. Interesting.

Regards

Star man

[Star man]

Well....... could be a rock/boulder.          Even Big rocks have sharper edges and rounded points etc.


Then again, this is the butt plate of a Mosin Nagant rifle.  The Mosin Nagant was developed in the late 1800s and was about the only rifle around through to the 1970s.  There isn't a big civilian market for firearms, because unlike the US it requires special circumstances to permit one.  The semi auto SKS was developed in the 1950s, but civilians wouldnt have them. In 1959 there would have really only been TWO rifle types walking around.  The Mosin Nagant, and if military..... the SKS. 

Here is the Butt Plate of a Mosin Nagant.  I own plenty of both and can tell you the radius resemblance is striking... pun intended. 





Here is the Butt Plate of an SKS.






Then of course you have the grip butt of a Nagant pistol....  Like the rifle, it was about the only thing around for a crazy long time. 

I thought about the rifle butt as a possible explanation.  It’s not the same shape though.  If it hit his head at an angle the bottom of the injury should be flatter and one part of the injury would be much deeper than the other. 

Out of interest measure the width of the butt and then divide 9cm by the width to see what result you get and let me know.  That might be interesting.

One other thing- the fracture that runs from the depression is near the top.  If a gun butt was used then the maximum force applied would be at the bottom of Thibo’s injury and the shape should be flatter.

Good idea though.  Let us know the length/width ratio.

Regards

Star man

[Loose}{Cannon]

Case closed?

How much are you willing to rely on one persons opinion that quite possibly had little to no experience with this type of injury.   

[Loose}{Cannon]

I thought about the rifle butt as a possible explanation.  It’s not the same shape though.  If it hit his head at an angle the bottom of the injury should be flatter and one part of the injury would be much deeper than the other. 

Out of interest measure the width of the butt and then divide 9cm by the width to see what result you get and let me know.  That might be interesting.

One other thing- the fracture that runs from the depression is near the top.  If a gun butt was used then the maximum force applied would be at the bottom of Thibo’s injury and the shape should be flatter.

Good idea though.  Let us know the length/width ratio.

Regards

Star man

measure the width of the butt and then divide 9cm by the width

Do what?  the butts taper to a radius.


Which gun?  I have several of all three.   

Also, I would imagine alot would depend on the angle in which the strike happened.  Also, I would imagine there to be some 'give' to the skill when hit, and then some spring back from swelling etc.  I doubt the injury would resemble the object perfectly, especially if he had on a hat and or hood.   Lots of variables here.....

[Loose}{Cannon]

Not sure abut the exact measurement scale, but knowing the length of these buttplates... pretty close Im sure. 

[Loose}{Cannon]

Actually a bit big....  lemme measure and try again

[Loose}{Cannon]

Ok... this should be closer to scale.  I put a line across the Plate showing where I measured from.... at that location its 38mm across.  Thats about half the main impact area.  Once centered you can see the radius has a striking resemblance to the injury. 

This is the SKS.  Civilians wouldn't have these in 1959. 

[Loose}{Cannon]

Ah.... the Marine Corps days.   

"well over 550 pounds of force" 



 
Shatter a cheekbone.   

[Loose}{Cannon]

Impact = 450 pounds.   

"break ribs and damage internal organs"

[sarapuk]

Thought that this was interesting in the context of this thread.  It might have absolutely no bearing, but it might be an eye brow raiser for those who think they have their feet firmly planted on the ground.

In the early 20th century Russian scientist were experimenting with trying to hybridise apes and humans.  Breeding apes and humans to create a hybrid.  The work was authorised and funded by the government.  As far as we know it never worked.  But is there something we don't know?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ilya_Ivanovich_Ivanov

Regards

Star man

Interesting. The name IVANOV obviously a coincidence. I think there are many cases of such experimentation. The NAZIS did such work as well. No Evidence that any of it succeded though.

[sarapuk]

Just another observation on Thibo’s skull fracture:

If you orient the ball of the thumb to line up with Thibo’s depressed fracture then the Index finger lines up with the elongated fracture that runs around to the frontal bone and the base of the hand corresponds to the fracture that runs underneath through the saddle.  Try it. 

Regards

Star man

Interesting. Obviously it wouldnt have been a Human Hand because a Human Hand would not have been powerful enough.

[sarapuk]

This a quote from the main site in relation to Thibo’s skull injury:

Vozrozhdenny, who undertook the autopsy, excluded accidental fall on the rock as a possible cause for such a massive and unusual fracture

Thibo’ fracture is decribed as “massive and unusual “. Interesting.

Regards

Star man

Very interesting, yet there are still those who suggest a fall was responsible. I have never believed that a fall caused those injuries.

[sarapuk]

Well....... could be a rock/boulder.          Even Big rocks have sharper edges and rounded points etc.


Then again, this is the butt plate of a Mosin Nagant rifle.  The Mosin Nagant was developed in the late 1800s and was about the only rifle around through to the 1970s.  There isn't a big civilian market for firearms, because unlike the US it requires special circumstances to permit one.  The semi auto SKS was developed in the 1950s, but civilians wouldnt have them. In 1959 there would have really only been TWO rifle types walking around.  The Mosin Nagant, and if military..... the SKS. 

Here is the Butt Plate of a Mosin Nagant.  I own plenty of both and can tell you the radius resemblance is striking... pun intended. 





Here is the Butt Plate of an SKS.






Then of course you have the grip butt of a Nagant pistol....  Like the rifle, it was about the only thing around for a crazy long time. 

But the Evidence suggests that the injuries were not caused by a fall on rocks or of a rock or similar hard object hitting the Skull.

[sarapuk]

Case closed?

How much are you willing to rely on one persons opinion that quite possibly had little to no experience with this type of injury.   

One persons opinion  !  ?  Evidence says otherwise.

[sarapuk]

Ok... this should be closer to scale.  I put a line across the Plate showing where I measured from.... at that location its 38mm across.  Thats about half the main impact area.  Once centered you can see the radius has a striking resemblance to the injury. 

This is the SKS.  Civilians wouldn't have these in 1959. 




Being hit by one of those things would be a bit like being hit by a Rock. And therefore we would expect to see more Evidence of that on the Skull. But there was no such Evidence of that type of hit.

[sarapuk]

Impact = 450 pounds.   

"break ribs and damage internal organs"

The injuries to Dubinina do not appear to have been the result of someone kicking her.

[Loose}{Cannon]

But the Evidence suggests that the injuries were not caused by a fall on rocks or of a rock or similar hard object hitting the Skull.

Says who?

[Star man]

Ok.  This is getting interesting.  Given Thibo's two hats it is impossible that the impact injury may be slightly different from whatever made it.  If it was an impact that it.

However, it seems obvious when you put the two Diagrams together above that Thibo's injury is clearly a different shape.  It's much wider, it has a rounded bottom and rounded top which is slightly more pointed, just like the top of the ball of the thumb where it joined the thumb itself.  If the gun butt hit Thibo's head at an angle then the bottom of the fracture would only see the flat part of the butt.  I can't see how it would be so rounded. 

A more likely shape would be the handle of a pistol, but the size of the injury would mean the handle would be very large 9cm x 7cm.  I don't know if there were any pistol handles that matched those proportions?  One other thing if it was a pistol handle then it would need to deliver about 450kg of force.

Also, could it just be a coincidence that  the injury identically resembles the proportions of the ball of a thumb?

I know it's weird but there it is.

Lyuda chest injuries were created by massive blows.  A single blow that cleanly fractured all the ribs on one side in a straight line.  Over 800kg of force, at least.  Individual ribs could be broken with much less force, but then there wouldn't be a straight fracture line running through all the ribs.  The ribs would be broken randomly.

Same for Semyon's ribs - the same level of force and one massive blow.  If they fell then given differences in weight you would probably expect a slightly different pattern. 

Let's consider a fall just for interest:

Thibo falls and hits his head "only" on a rock resulting in a massive injury that exactly resembles the proportions of the ball,of the thumb.

Lyuda also falls and lands on her chest "only" on a rock that causes massive damage fracturing both sides.  Only sustains minor injuries elsewhere.

Semyon also falls on his chest "only" on a rock that causes massive damage fracturing one side of his chest.  Only sustains minor injuries elsewhere.

Now let's look at a human cause:

Someone hits Thibo with a rock to his head that just happens to create a fracture with the exact proportions of a ball of the thumb.

Then they pick up 150kg to 300 kg rock and drop it on Lyuda and Semyon, but they leave Kolevatov alive.

Regards

Star man

[Loose}{Cannon]

Welp, this is the Yeti thread so debating the injuries are not from a Yeti is futile. 

Leaving thought.   Why would the skull wound not taper out into an overall larger area?  When a rock hits a windshield, does it only affect the contact point?   This is common sense stuff thats not worth arguing about.   

[jarrfan]

I don't find the Yeti theory plausible. Even if they were attacked by a Yeti what accounts for the missing eyeballs of the three in the  ravine? Was this caused by animals or fish? A blow to the chest enough to cause broken ribs would not cause someone's eyes to leave their eye sockets. So is it considered that the eyes were not affected by the damaging blows and by animals?

If there were a force, such as a ball lightening, electric force that broke their ribs, their eye sockets would have been damaged all around the eye area i.e., burns, acid, etc.

If the conclusion is that the eyes were lost during the months long period they lay in the river is the plausible theory.

If a Yeti or even a bear attack, there should be amounts of flesh ripped and it would  be visible on most bodies. The three exposed and found first don't speak to an attack by an animal.


The possibility of elk or reindeer stampede is still possible and would incapacitate the hikers and make them leave the tent in order to assess their wounds and make plans to try and survive.

I do have a question, why in March was a Mansi member at the site? Especially knowing there would be bodies there and not all of the hikers had been found? Was he just passing by, or was he investigating on his own? I cannot think of any reason that he should  have been there knowing it was a devastating event. I wonder about this. If the Mansi are telling hikers not to go there, what was he doing there?

The foot prints don't give too much detail and the site was not secured.

If the Dyatlov Pass investigation team were to monitor the site during the winter with cameras like the hunters use might give up the details. Some type of sonic monitoring for electrical activity and sound wave monitoring should give info about the site being a place of supernatural events. Geiger counter monitoring for a few months.

I have to go back to the 1993 incident where the hikers died in August and during the day, the first one became ill, bled from his nose and died. Then another hiker began banging her head on rocks. Even though it did not happen in the same spot, it was definitely some kind of supernatural event either electric, sound, breathing poison gases, etc., that caused that melee. it was described quite well by the person who survived. So this tells me no Yeti, no bear, no elk, no military, no poison eaten, perehaps poison gases exposure.

Keep up the fight. Jarrfan

[Star man]

Welp, this is the Yeti thread so debating the injuries are not from a Yeti is futile. 

Leaving thought.   Why would the skull wound not taper out into an overall larger area?  When a rock hits a windshield, does it only affect the contact point?   This is common sense stuff thats not worth arguing about.   

So the point of talking about the injuries in terms of them not being made by a yeti is show/demonstrate the unlikely conditions that would be required for the injuries to have been caused by either an accident or human intervention.

I don't know about the likelihood of the injuries tapering wrt impacts on a skull.  I suppose it must be possible for some tapering, but the outline of the injury as shown in the diagram is very distinct.

Naturally I wouldn't expect anyone to be totally convinced by the information presented that it was a Yeti instead of an accident or human attack.

The point that should be more clear is that there is something very odd about these injuries when considering them all together.

Regards

Star man

[Star man]

I don't find the Yeti theory plausible. Even if they were attacked by a Yeti what accounts for the missing eyeballs of the three in the  ravine? Was this caused by animals or fish? A blow to the chest enough to cause broken ribs would not cause someone's eyes to leave their eye sockets. So is it considered that the eyes were not affected by the damaging blows and by animals?

If there were a force, such as a ball lightening, electric force that broke their ribs, their eye sockets would have been damaged all around the eye area i.e., burns, acid, etc.

If the conclusion is that the eyes were lost during the months long period they lay in the river is the plausible theory.

If a Yeti or even a bear attack, there should be amounts of flesh ripped and it would  be visible on most bodies. The three exposed and found first don't speak to an attack by an animal.


The possibility of elk or reindeer stampede is still possible and would incapacitate the hikers and make them leave the tent in order to assess their wounds and make plans to try and survive.

I do have a question, why in March was a Mansi member at the site? Especially knowing there would be bodies there and not all of the hikers had been found? Was he just passing by, or was he investigating on his own? I cannot think of any reason that he should  have been there knowing it was a devastating event. I wonder about this. If the Mansi are telling hikers not to go there, what was he doing there?

The foot prints don't give too much detail and the site was not secured.

If the Dyatlov Pass investigation team were to monitor the site during the winter with cameras like the hunters use might give up the details. Some type of sonic monitoring for electrical activity and sound wave monitoring should give info about the site being a place of supernatural events. Geiger counter monitoring for a few months.

I have to go back to the 1993 incident where the hikers died in August and during the day, the first one became ill, bled from his nose and died. Then another hiker began banging her head on rocks. Even though it did not happen in the same spot, it was definitely some kind of supernatural event either electric, sound, breathing poison gases, etc., that caused that melee. it was described quite well by the person who survived. So this tells me no Yeti, no bear, no elk, no military, no poison eaten, perehaps poison gases exposure.

Keep up the fight. Jarrfan

You make an interesting point about the eyes and facial injuries.  Let's add some further info to these:

When apes attack they often attack the body and the face.  Mutilating the face is actually quite common in normal ape attacks.  Who knows what a Yeti would do?

But ask yourself this - the two people who have the worst facial injuries and missing eyes are also the two who have the worst chest injuries, consistent with them having being mauled to the worst extent.  It is actually a shame that they were Ian stream bed because if they were not then it would me more clear that there is something odd about the facial injuries.  Lyuda's face is the worst - missing tissue around lips, skull, smashed nose cartilage, missing eyes and tongue.  En there is Semyon missing eyes, tissue missing around eye brows large laceration around the back of the head.  In known ape attacks it is quite common for the ape to drag the victim around.

So, I don't think that the eyes would pop out due to the blows.  The attack on the face would be specific.

One other thing if an ape like creature was attacking one of the group, then I doubt the others would just stand by and watch, they attack it too, punching kicking etc.  they did have a knife which was never found.  An attack with a knife would interrupt the ape attack, and make it less severe.  Also it might eventually drive it away.  So if Koleveatov had the knife, he might have stabbed it several times and eventually drove it away.  The knife may have been le in the beast.  Hence it was never found.

Regards

Star man

[Loose}{Cannon]

Welp...  All you have to do is produce a Yeti.  A big animal with a thumb like that would consume a late of food, and it has to reproduce.  Should be easy.

[cennetkusu]

Yeti can exist in the world. This is possible. But as far as I know, he has never had any attacks on people. And there's no reason to attack. Yeti could not have attacked young people, even if they were close to them. I mean, I think he was somewhere close by. And it seemed as if he had predicted what was going to happen in the photo. So if Yeti has no extraordinary power, Yeti cannot be responsible for these deaths

[jarrfan]

This is the sad story of Charlotte Nash whose face was destroyed, eyes ripped out, so even though this was a chimp and not an ape, they are in the same line. He bit off both of her  hands.

https://abcnews.go.com/Health/victim-chimp-attack-shows-destroyed-face-oprah/story?id=9053544

I cannot say if this proves or disproves a Yeti was involved.

Regards. Jarrfan

[Loose}{Cannon]

The only one that was bitten was Yuri, and he did it to himself.   

[sarapuk]

But the Evidence suggests that the injuries were not caused by a fall on rocks or of a rock or similar hard object hitting the Skull.

Says who?

Well there is stuff in The Dyatlov Pass Website. We have the Autopsy stuff.

[sarapuk]

Welp, this is the Yeti thread so debating the injuries are not from a Yeti is futile. 

Leaving thought.   Why would the skull wound not taper out into an overall larger area?  When a rock hits a windshield, does it only affect the contact point?   This is common sense stuff thats not worth arguing about.   

So the point of talking about the injuries in terms of them not being made by a yeti is show/demonstrate the unlikely conditions that would be required for the injuries to have been caused by either an accident or human intervention.

I don't know about the likelihood of the injuries tapering wrt impacts on a skull.  I suppose it must be possible for some tapering, but the outline of the injury as shown in the diagram is very distinct.

Naturally I wouldn't expect anyone to be totally convinced by the information presented that it was a Yeti instead of an accident or human attack.

The point that should be more clear is that there is something very odd about these injuries when considering them all together.

Regards

Star man

Well said and well said about your analysis re the Head injury. You have basically laid a fairly clear path towards it not being the result of another Human or even Rock Fall or Hit by a Rock. Along with the Autopsy Findings etc we may be looking at some kind of completely Unknown Quantity. So that brings the YETI THEORY nicely into the Equation, or Equations.

[sarapuk]

Welp...  All you have to do is produce a Yeti.  A big animal with a thumb like that would consume a late of food, and it has to reproduce.  Should be easy.

Well thats assuming that the hypothetical YETI is an animal that eats and breeds like Apes or Humans.

[Star man]

Welp...  All you have to do is produce a Yeti.  A big animal with a thumb like that would consume a late of food, and it has to reproduce.  Should be easy.

Yeaaaaaeeehh!!!!!  Will have to work on that one but you're right.

Regards

Star man