Exploring The Yeti Theory

[sarapuk]

But surely if the movement of the Hyoid Bone is normal due to Decomposition then why bother to mention this in the Autopsy Report  !  ?   It appears to have been mentioned because its not a normal thing to happen.

The decomposition is what makes it "not normal".....   She was found with her head and neck slumped over a boulder. Is it not possible for the weight of her body and the rotten nature of the area to cause movement in cartilage that has movement to begin with?   Again, is it easier to wiggle a bone loose from a thawed dead rotten fish, or a freshly dead and frozen fish?

But why does the Autopsy Report report the Unusual Movement ! ? You are saying that Decomposition is normal in this particular case  !  ?

[sarapuk]

Ask yourself this....

Why would it be a Yeti, and not for instance a giant purple penguin?  This theory requires a big non human animal....  Why not a flying Mothman or a shapeshifting Chupacabra?

Giant Purple Penguin  !  ?  But people have been reporting large Ape like Creatures for hundreds of years right up to present times. I dont see or hear of any reports of GIANT PURPLE PENGUINS though.  Flying Creatures have been reported and also Shapeshifters. And Chupacabra.

[sarapuk]

Where do I currently stand on this?

As I said above I am not claiming that the dpi was caused by a Yeti.  We don’t know if they exist.  However if you laid out all of the current theories in a circle and placed a indicative evidence compass in the middle I would say that to me it seems to be pointing strongly at the possibility of some kind of large powerful ape like creature and slightly towards the military test.  The only known species of ape I think is capable of causing those injury patterns is a Gorilla.  So I still think the compass is pointing towards the military test using some kind of ape as a test subject:

Ape + radiation + cover up =?

But if it wasn’t something like that then it seems to me that we are left with the really bizarre possibilities of a Yeti or some other weird thing.

Regards

Star man

We are moving towards the unknown. When I first came upon this Dyatlov Mystery My first thoughts was that it was some kind of Creature, whether of this World or whatever. Then I became interested in the UFO reports. And then the Radiation reports. ETC ETC.

[Star man]

Where do I currently stand on this?

As I said above I am not claiming that the dpi was caused by a Yeti.  We don’t know if they exist.  However if you laid out all of the current theories in a circle and placed a indicative evidence compass in the middle I would say that to me it seems to be pointing strongly at the possibility of some kind of large powerful ape like creature and slightly towards the military test.  The only known species of ape I think is capable of causing those injury patterns is a Gorilla.  So I still think the compass is pointing towards the military test using some kind of ape as a test subject:

Ape + radiation + cover up =?

But if it wasn’t something like that then it seems to me that we are left with the really bizarre possibilities of a Yeti or some other weird thing.

Regards

Star man

We are moving towards the unknown. When I first came upon this Dyatlov Mystery My first thoughts was that it was some kind of Creature, whether of this World or whatever. Then I became interested in the UFO reports. And then the Radiation reports. ETC ETC.

I think it's important to have an open mind on these things.  It is equally important to have the devils advocate who challenges the strange and weird ideas.  LC does a good job at this but I am surprised that there are not more?  All ideas, theories and evidence needs to be tested.

One thing though.  Like all criminal cases the dpi requires evidence.  How do we get this evidence:

Existing case files
People visiting the area and investigating themselves ( take hat off to you)
Converting existing ambiguous evidence into solid evidence through analytical techniques and expertise.

Regards

Star man

[Loose}{Cannon]

LC does a good job at this but I am surprised that there are not more?

I would guess there is a certain percentage of more modest and verbally conservative then myself.   

[track hunter]

Where do I currently stand on this?

As I said above I am not claiming that the dpi was caused by a Yeti.  We don’t know if they exist.  However if you laid out all of the current theories in a circle and placed a indicative evidence compass in the middle I would say that to me it seems to be pointing strongly at the possibility of some kind of large powerful ape like creature and slightly towards the military test.  The only known species of ape I think is capable of causing those injury patterns is a Gorilla.  So I still think the compass is pointing towards the military test using some kind of ape as a test subject:

Ape + radiation + cover up =?

But if it wasn’t something like that then it seems to me that we are left with the really bizarre possibilities of a Yeti or some other weird thing.

Regards

Star man

I recommend to read http://sasquatchgenomeproject.org/index.html, And this is our Russian site. Enough evidence http://alamas.ru/

[Loose}{Cannon]

The Patterson hoax is the main picture....  I don't care who you are, thats funny right there.

[Star man]

Would just like to go back to the Lyuda's hyoid bone and it's "unusual" movement.  The autopsy reports of all three of the other rav 4 report that the hyoid bone is intact.  Curious.  If the unusual movement of the hyoid bone were due to decomposition and is normal, why aren't the hyoid bones of the other three moving unusually?  They have been there for just as long in the stream bed?

Regards

Star man

[Loose}{Cannon]

Because she was slumped over a rock. 

[Star man]

Because she was slumped over a rock.

Why would being slumped over a rock make any difference?

Regards

Star man

[Star man]

Where are the forensic details on the foot prints?  Does anyone here think that the case files reflect an adequate  investigation of the foot prints?

Regards

Star man

[Morski]

Because she was slumped over a rock.

Why would being slumped over a rock make any difference?

Regards

Star man

If I remember correctly, she was slumped over the rock, face down, and water was running through her open mouth. So...

[Star man]

There is a lot of information available in the case files on the clothing.  We know what they were wearing, whether it was torn, cut or burned.  We not whether it was shabby or not.  But another question for me is where is the analysis of the biological samples - blood stains - although DNA analysis was nt available in 1959 blood groups were easily discernible and the difference between human and non human blood types could be resolved.  Again in a criminal investigation would you not look for blood groups that did not match the hikers?  These are just some peculiarities.

Regards

Star man

[Star man]

Because she was slumped over a rock.

Why would being slumped over a rock make any difference?

Regards

Star man

If I remember correctly, she was slumped over the rock, face down, and water was running through her open mouth. So...

I was wondering the same thing.  So did any of the others in the stream bed have their heads in water?  I'll have to look into that.

Regards

Star man

[Star man]

Quote from the main website:

The bodies of the men cannot be identified without removing them from the water.

This suggests that the men in the ravine had their faces in the water too?

Regards
Star man

[Loose}{Cannon]

Welp....   the three males were on their side with their mouths facing down stream. Think about sticking your head out of a car window at speed.... is there a difference between facing the airstream vs the back of your head towards the airstream?  In addition, the female had the weight of her upper body slumped of a rock applying pressure in odd areas, most likely the neck.  In addition, if the tongue was rotten, and the mouth open facing the incoming water stream, it would flop around in the mouth.  The hyoid bone is connected to the tongue just below the jaw and controls movement of the tongue particularly when swallowing.... what you you think will happen to a bone that controls the tongue in a facing the water stream plopping around while rotten will do to the hyoid bone?   Perhaps give it some "unusual" movement?    Remember, if the tongue was missing from decomposition but the hyoid bone remains without the flesh that it connects to..... would it have movement?   Again, if you lay out a dead fish to decompose and the flesh is rotten and even missing around the ribs..... would the ribs have movement?   

This is common sense stuff that shouldn't have to be explained in detail. 

[Star man]

Ok.  Some good points.  We should probably expect a faster rate of decay given that Lyuda face and open mouth was directly in the flow of the water.  But the mention of “unusual “ movement of the hyoid in Lyuda autopsy report is still suspicious, especially as the autopsy reports of the others specifically mention that they are intact.  Why differentiate between those with intact hyoid bone and those with “unusual “ movement?

The autopsy reports do not mention any other type of intact bones.  He didn’t say ankle bones were in intact for instance.  Why specifically mention the hyoid bone?

Regards

Star man

[Loose}{Cannon]

I dunno...  perhaps they were secretly trying to hide that Yeti is a double agent for the KGB and has a weird fetish for hyoid bone necklaces.

[jarrfan]

The Yeti theory is still in the hat. The problem I have with it is there is no ripping, tearing, shredding of skin that would occur (I would think) with an animal so big and with claws like a bear. Also biting. If it had been any kind of an animal the marks and wounds would show this type of pattern. What I see is kicking, hitting with fists, etc.

[Star man]

I dunno...  perhaps they were secretly trying to hide that Yeti is a double agent for the KGB and has a weird fetish for hyoid bone necklaces.

Putting Yetis aside - when I first started looking at the dpi I thought that the missing eyes and tongue could easily be explained by small animal predation and natural decay processes.  But closer examination of the injuries points to something more sinister in my opinion, and this raises the question about the other reported body damage including  Lyuda's tongue and other facial injuries and Semyon's eyes and facial injuries.  The two people with  the more significant flail chest injuries both also have missing eyes and other facial damage.  The unusual movement of Lyuda's hyoid bone may be an important clue.  It should also be noted that Lyuda had 100 cc of red mucous mass in her stomach which is likely to be blood.  This would point towards the tongue being removed before she died.  If this is the case then I doubt that the tongue was removed by small animal predator or decay.  I Think the hyoid bone and it's state as reported in the autopsy could really do with expert comment.  Unfortunately I am not an expert in this field.

The hyoid bone combined with coagulated blood in the stomach of Lyuda points towards the tongue being forcibly removed.  If this is the case then I suspect her and Semyon's eyes may also have been forcibly removed, but still may be the result of small animal and birds.  I think these clues are important for any theory that proposes a violent end for the dpi group.

Regards

star man

[Star man]

The Yeti theory is still in the hat. The problem I have with it is there is no ripping, tearing, shredding of skin that would occur (I would think) with an animal so big and with claws like a bear. Also biting. If it had been any kind of an animal the marks and wounds would show this type of pattern. What I see is kicking, hitting with fists, etc.

I don't think that we should assume that a Yeti has razor sharp claws like a bear.  Nevertheless, you make a very good point.  Where are the bite marks?  A Gorilla with its human like nails is still actually capable of disembowelling a human.  Is it possible that whatever attacked them did not have time to utilise all of its natural weapons because it too was under attack, by the people who were attempting to defend their friends?  The knife is still missing.  What happened to it.  Was it used in defence of those who were mauled?  Was it plunged into something that limped away with a knife stuck in its hide?  I don't know.  But a very good question.

Regards

Star man

[Loose}{Cannon]

Your in luck.   

http://forum.dyatlovpass.com/index.php?topic=187.0

The situation regarding the eyes, perhaps tongue, etc could certainly be postmortem predation.  I would likely give the original pathologist benefit of the doubt on their interpretation.

https://dyatlovpass.com/case-files-355-357?rbid=17743

Damage to the soft tissue of the head and ‘bath skin’ wrinkling to the extremities are the post-mortem changes (rot and decay) of Dubinina’s body, which was underwater before it was found.

When palpating the neck, there is extraordinary mobility of the thyrohyal and thyroid cartilages.

Diaphragm of mouth and tongue absent. The upper margin of the hyoid bone is exposed.

There is no tongue in the oral cavity. Mucous cavities of the mouth are gray-greenish in color

[Loose}{Cannon]

In addition, the forums autopsy reports need to be updated/copied from the parent site.  Until we get around to doing that, I would suggest using the translated version on dyatlovpass.com as Teddy herself translated the report and would be MUCH more accurate then what google translate does. 

The correct translation 'extraordinary'

there is extraordinary mobility of the thyrohyal and thyroid cartilages.

There happens to be THREE definition uses for the word extraordinary.

Extraordinary
EXTRAOR'DINARY, adjective extror'dinary. [Latin extraordinarius; extra and ordinarius, usual, from ordo, order.]

1. Beyond or out of the common order or method; not in the usual, customary or regular course; not ordinary. extraordinary evils require extraordinary remedies.

2. Exceeding the common degree or measure; hence, remarkable; uncommon; rare; wonderful; as the extraordinary talents of Shakespeare; the extraordinary powers of Newton; an edifice of extraordinary grandeur.

3. Special; particular; sent for a special purpose, or on a particular occasion; as an extraordinary courier or messenger; an embassador extraordinary; a gazette extraordinary

[Loose}{Cannon]

Now, if I broke my leg and the doctor said there is extraordinary movement of the bones....  does this warrant a bigfoot investigation?

[Star man]

Now, if I broke my leg and the doctor said there is extraordinary movement of the bones....  does this warrant a bigfoot investigation?

It would not be first line of investigation.  But then it was not my first line of investigation of the dpi either.

Regards

Star man

[Star man]

Your in luck.   

http://forum.dyatlovpass.com/index.php?topic=187.0

The situation regarding the eyes, perhaps tongue, etc could certainly be postmortem predation.  I would likely give the original pathologist benefit of the doubt on their interpretation.

https://dyatlovpass.com/case-files-355-357?rbid=17743

Damage to the soft tissue of the head and ‘bath skin’ wrinkling to the extremities are the post-mortem changes (rot and decay) of Dubinina’s body, which was underwater before it was found.

When palpating the neck, there is extraordinary mobility of the thyrohyal and thyroid cartilages.

Diaphragm of mouth and tongue absent. The upper margin of the hyoid bone is exposed.

There is no tongue in the oral cavity. Mucous cavities of the mouth are gray-greenish in color

Well the independent pathologist report does confirm my own assumption that the chest injuries were unlikely to have been caused by multiple blows from a human.  Large surface area impact such as fall or car crash.  There are no tyre tracks.  Have already discussed toughts on possibility of fall.  Although he says the eyes and tongue "could" have been caused by decomposition and predation he refers back the the opinion of the original pathologist who doesn't say a lot about it.  I'll have to have another look at that.

Regards

Star man

Missing tongue + blood in stomach + extraordinary movement of the hyoid bone. 

[Loose}{Cannon]

Missing tongue + blood in stomach + extraordinary movement of the hyoid bone

can only mean.....

[Loose}{Cannon]

who doesn't say a lot about it

    holy crap....  its all over the place.  Slipping that, rotten this, greenish that.  1/3rd of the conclusion at the bottom points out the body and particularly the head is rotten and decayed.   What do you call it when organisms feed on flesh? 


I can't even grab ahold of my own tongue....  how Yeti with hands big enough to pop a head like a grape do it? 

[Loose}{Cannon]

It wasn't all blood in the stomach, but still....  she had massive internal bleeding.   Whats the point?  Are you suggesting that blood in the stomach can ONLY be a result of yeti ripping out the tongue?

[Star man]

Missing tongue + blood in stomach + extraordinary movement of the hyoid bone

can only mean.....

Nice picture.  Not quite what I was imagining though. 

Obviously the hyoid bone , tongue and blood would not in itself lead one to the conclusion in the attached picture.  And yes Lyuda was decomposing in the stream (God bless her).  I am merely pointing out that there are three pieces of information that point towards a conclusion and that is not necessarily a white one eyed cyclops yeti or any other yeti.   

If something looks like a duck and walks like a duck then it probably is a duck.

Brown + soft/sticky + smells like poo = chocolate ice cream?

Regards
Star man