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81

General Discussion / Re: The clues in the snow

« Last post by Osi on October 22, 2026, 12:14:05 AM »

I cannot fathom how the final state of the tent poles could be taken as definitive proof of anything. If I were one of the first mountaineers to cut through the tent fabric to get out, I would have tried to re-erect and secure the collapsed poles. By tightening the guy lines attached to the poles, I would have hoped to lift the tent fabric, thereby creating more space for any companions trapped inside. Furthermore, I would have reasoned that straightening the poles and tautening the fabric might cause the layer of snow on top to slide off to the sides. If I intended to descend to the forest and return to the tent later, I would have set the poles upright to ensure the tent remained visible. How can we be certain that the two individuals who presumably exited the tent—Dyatlov and Krivoshchenko—did not attempt to do exactly that? Moreover, consider the situation of the people who first discovered the tent; digging around its edges to see what lay inside would have been a completely natural, instinctive human reaction. How can we prove that, while excavating the snow with an ice axe—in an effort to uncover the tent—they did not, perhaps reflexively, shift or displace the poles? Unless these individuals were explicitly asked whether they had touched the tent poles, the actions they took at the scene—driven by the hope of finding their friends alive—should be viewed as fundamentally human and compassionate gestures. In the midst of such chaos, it is entirely natural for certain actions to have been taken yet subsequently forgotten, or simply overlooked; this is a matter of human conscience.

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General Discussion / Re: The clues in the snow

« Last post by Osi on October 21, 2026, 11:23:47 PM »

I find the concerns regarding the use of a stove in areas exposed to storms—especially the idea of ​​sleeping in the same space as a lit stove—to be entirely valid. However, when everyone is awake—for instance, during the early morning hours—a stove could certainly be tested, regardless of the terrain conditions. You could verify whether it is burning properly and monitor for any carbon monoxide emissions. The text mentions the use of a log in or near the stove; if you were to take a pine log—10 cm in diameter, with both ends sawn flat—and split it into five or six pieces with an axe, then burn them (perhaps along with some kindling), it would be more than sufficient for heating the space and cooking food. Assembling three or four sections of chimney pipe and attaching them to the stove would take only a few minutes. It is utterly absurd to treat a stove—which can be used under controlled and manageable conditions—as if it were some terrifying monster.
Although I have not conducted an in-depth investigation, I recall coming across accounts from local residents living at lower altitudes—dating back to the final days of January—describing some of the most severe cold spells seen in recent times. Conditions in the mountains must have been even more dire. Furthermore, foresters, drawing on their own experience, had issued warnings that the weather was set to deteriorate further.
I would hope that any meteorological system capable of measuring snowfall around Kholat with such precision—down to the millimeter—would also be equipped to document exactly when and in what quantities the 1 to 1.2 meters of snow, found at the 800-meter elevation where the tent was pitched, actually fell.

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General Discussion / Re: The clues in the snow

« Last post by Ziljoe on October 21, 2026, 09:29:14 PM »

The tent , the stove , the tents and the stove's.

Not all tents are the same , not all stoves are the same . Stoves are removable, stoves can be extinguished , some stoves are fine in the wind.

Some stoves are used in temporary igloos some stoves are used in snow holes.

The tents are used in-between trees, and in open spaces.

The skis around the tent . 8-9;pairs of skis were reported under the tent , 1 pair were report lying down at the entrance and the standing near the entrance. The skis were used by the searchers on the first day as I believe some of those that came by helicopter had none. The photo with the skis standing is said to be either late 27th or the 28th. This is after everyone dug in and around the tent.

It is impossible to be exact on snow fall , wind and temperature. Snow can drift by wind . It is fine that you don't believe it was an avalanche, of any sort. There is no need to try and show it's impossible as you will never be able to do so .

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General Discussion / Re: The clues in the snow

« Last post by bongyi on October 21, 2026, 08:52:40 PM »

I will say it again - this is independent of any book or practice - when setting up the tent on a snowfield, the tent will not have the necessary stability to safely install the stove in it. If the tent will not be able to withstand the stormy wind and collapse, the hot stove will fall on the people in the tent. This is an unacceptable risk. In ideal weather conditions, the stove can also be installed in the snow field, but this carries the risk that if the weather changes, the stove will turn into a potential source of danger! This tent is designed for setting up between trees! It can remain stable when tied to trees. Of course, trees can also fall in stormy winds, so this also carries a risk of the stove falling! In stormy winds, it's best to forget this stove!

Today's modern tents are different, they are made with self-supporting bars, which are capable of flexible deformation, i.e. they can get out of the way of stormy winds. In such cases, those in the tent must support the windward side of the tent with their backs and strongly trust that the wind will not have the strength to move the entire tent and sled it down a steep slope together with those in it!

You can be sure that when the wind blows the tent with terrible force, you will give thanks for it if there is nothing in the tent that burns with flame!

It is quite difficult for me to interpret the positions of the skis and poles in the picture taken when the tent was found - which would have been responsible for the fixing and stability of the tent. The two skis stabbed in the snow appear to be on the same side of the tent. The other side is only visible to a limited extent, but there should be skis there too. In other words, one ski should be on one side of the tent and the other on the other. Of course, it is also possible that a pair of skis were pierced on each side.

We didn't pay enough attention to the question of why is the tent collapsed? Assuming any kind of avalanche, the avalanche would have clung to the fabric of the tent, the tension ropes and the skis and knocked them down. But the skis are standing and the tent has remained in place, only collapsing in the middle and at one end! Why? Are the ropes that were attached to the ski torn? Can you see the tear on them? Why is this question not examined and clarified?

A possible scenario is that the tent was collapsed by the hikers themselves when they left it so that the wind could not catch the empty tent and take it away. In this case, there would be no tears on the tensioning ropes!

Reliable information about the environmental conditions could only be obtained from the diaries of other tour groups moving in the area! Are they available somewhere? I think that in 2019, Pigoltsina presented us with a meteorological reconstruction of the circumstances of the events of '59 that tried to serve the authorities' avalanche theory, which closed the case. In light of this, it is quite interesting how narrowly it covers the amount of precipitation! In practice, it is only described in a bracketed sentence as a quantity exceeding 10 mm. This won't make an avalanche! A heavy snowfall would fit exactly into the narrative intended to be believed, but there is no such thing! Strange!
Anyone who fantasizes about significant snowfall in the days of February 1-2 1959 must refute Pigoltsina's statement about the amount of precipitation! You can do this by summoning the weather log entries of the other tour groups moving around the area for the days in question and reporting abundant snowfall in them!

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General Discussion / Re: The clues in the snow

« Last post by Ziljoe on October 21, 2026, 04:45:09 PM »

On the one hand the stove is part of a conspiracy theory centered around the tent being somewhat other than where it actually was found.

The other suggestion seems to be that while on 1079, a morning fire was made in the stove to dry garments among other things. This is of course a supposition and not fact supported by the stove itself, ash, nor clothes set to dry.

There is nothing to gain by arguing that a stowed away stove couldn't be used because it could not be supported. It is a spurious argument which does not produce any findings significant to the advancement of the case .

I think bongyi has miss understood the quote. The stove can be erected if wanted,  snow prints stay in some places and not in others , 21 days had passed before anyone arrived. We don't know the temperature, wind or snow fall.

All we can conclude from the data assuming the photos of digging the snow out are genuine is at the time of digging the tent platform, the new surface snow was minimal, at about 30mm approx looking at the back packs and hand on the snow bank. Then we have the raised foot prints . I would argue that this is a new snow fall or arrival of snow after the erected the tent.

Interestingly we can note , that not only did the dig a trench in that photo, they also stuck many skis in the snow above that tench that would also cut through the snow layers. Just another little interference with a snow bank.

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General Discussion / Re: Why did Igor die?

« Last post by Ziljoe on October 21, 2026, 04:33:47 PM »

Amashilu, what is your thinking about the progression of the events in the forest?

Glennm, I wish I could answer that question.
Why did Igor die?
Did someone really climb the tree? and if so, why on earth would they do that?
How did Krivonischenko burn his left shin?
I have to start with simple facts, one at a time, and see where each one leads, before arriving at a place where I can actually build a theory or a timeline.

It would seem reasonable to assume Igor died from cold exposure. The body is in a posture that is common for deaths from extreme cold and hypothermia. The muscles react in that way when lying on ones back.

The instructions from the hiking manuals explain exactly why people climb trees. So do the archived reports from other hikes. Sometimes they do for viewing in the distance and other times to get the best dry branches for a fire . In an emergency, here are some of the instructions given in the manuals below.


"A serious emergency situation: a group gets lost in bad weather, loses their skis, and descends to the edge of the forest. The forest, with its ability to start a fire, offers salvation to the struggling tourist group. The leader or experienced hikers must quell panic and motivate the group to take action (after all, hunters and taiga dwellers spend the night in the forest without tents in winter). Therefore, they should head deeper into the forest to find a lull from the wind. The strongest go ahead to dig a trench in the snow. An exhausted comrade should not be left to rest (they won't survive); everyone must stick together. Having chosen a site for an emergency camp with plenty of dead wood, the group decides where to start a fire. If an axe and saw are unavailable, a spot with plenty of thin deadwood or large trees with dry lower branches that can be broken off by hand is chosen. Two or three people gather firewood for the night, while the rest dig a hole to the ground. Snow from the pit is carried up in backpacks and windbreakers, the bottom of the pit is lined with spruce branches, the top is partially covered with branches, and then a fire is lit. The group warms up and settles down for the night.

If the snow cover is shallow or the ground is open, the chosen spot under large trees is cleared of snow to the ground, a shelter or windbreak is built, firewood is stored for the night, and a fire is lit. Everyone warms up and dries their clothes.

Yuri most likely got his burn from the fire, it is a graded radiation burn , in keeping with the angle of his limb when his body was found.

87

General Discussion / Re: The clues in the snow

« Last post by GlennM on October 21, 2026, 04:26:23 PM »

On the one hand the stove is part of a conspiracy theory centered around the tent being somewhat other than where it actually was found.

The other suggestion seems to be that while on 1079, a morning fire was made in the stove to dry garments among other things. This is of course a supposition and not fact supported by the stove itself, ash, nor clothes set to dry.

There is nothing to gain by arguing that a stowed away stove couldn't be used because it could not be supported. It is a spurious argument which does not produce any findings significant to the advancement of the case .

88

General Discussion / Re: The clues in the snow

« Last post by Ziljoe on October 21, 2026, 04:16:57 PM »

Camping on a mountain is not safe but we do it.

Fixing a tent on a mountainside still allows a stove to be used.

"But problems were arising. In the absence of any lateral ridgepoles, it was impossible to anchor the stove,"

from: https://dyatlovpass.com/firewood-in-the-tent?rbid=18461

Missing side bracing marked in red on pictures. The Gyatlovs' tent in the mountain side was not suitable for installing the stove.

Under the assumed weather conditions, even if the tent had been set up in the forest, the fall of the hot stove on the hikers and the ignition of the tent would still pose an extreme danger.  And the tent stability available on the snow field is not enough, as it is strong wind; a large amount of snow; God forbid an avalanche can cover the tent and the hot stove will fall on people.

I think this is a very dangerous construction! In stormy winds, it is forbidden to set it up or install it at all!

Bongyi.

The quote is from the book 1079. I have a copy right here in front of me. You keep changing your posts and now you miss the full quote.


Book 1079 , chapter 22 " outsiders in the area of height 1079"

"But problems were arising. In the absence of any lateral ridgepoles, it was impossible to anchor the stove, which broke away during the fall and had remained in the tent since the time of the accident. The piping had suffered as well. So it was decided to set up the tent without the stove, which was slip-covered together with the pipes."

It is not forbidden.

It is refering to the problem of removing the damaged tent and stove from the fallen tree to staging it's erection on the slope of 1079. The stagers can't erect the stove, because the tent and stove are damaged, not because hikers don't install stoves in a tent.

In the book , this is the reason given , it is a good book and a different view and theory .

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General Discussion / Re: Why did Igor die?

« Last post by GlennM on October 21, 2026, 04:14:53 PM »

Of course these are interesting details.Forging connections is the art. The connections can be constructed by looking at related events with a pre conceived explanation, or looking at them from a point of view which contends that there is no other realistic explanation. That is deucedly hard.

At the cedar, the idea that someone climbed it is actually a logical glue which joins the objective fact that broken branches were observed and the Yuri K displayed a head injury. Whether anyone climbed the tree is not a fact, rather it is a connection, but you already know this.

Ziljoe is one who really reasons from the facts backwards and forwards to sense the motivational and behavioral glue between factual points of reference.

Recently, we have some contributers who are taking issue with the facts as presented in case files and later discoveries. Their efforts to write a new narrative which confirms to. Their pre conceived explanation does nothing to move the needle toward truth, rather it mires the forum down into disputes and insults.

I suggest tackling Igor, Rustem and Zina, last actions. Go at it from the point of view that it could not be explained any other way and make logical sense to us.

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General Discussion / Re: The clues in the snow

« Last post by bongyi on October 21, 2026, 03:38:28 PM »

Just what is supposed to be the point here? Is this an argument just for the sake of it.

There was a suggestion that the hikers would have lit the stove in the morning after the frosty night and warmed up and dried the wet things before leaving.
It was explained that this idea was not possible for several reasons: the stove could not be put into operation; and there was no firewood.