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Religious Connections / Priest Elijah on TV-show (2024)
« Last post by Axelrod on Today at 05:43:06 AM »
Host Evgeny [YENIN] in a new TV show on OTV for the 65th anniversary: The mystery of the death of the Dyatlov group: 65 years of silence. What secret is hidden in the Ural Mountains? (March 26, 2024). I added some comments in brackets:
   



– This is the program “Everyone is talking about this”. For decades, we have not stopped talking about the mystery of the death of the Dyatlov group – the main secret and mystery of the Urals. Today, we will once again remember what happened 65 years ago, and tell you what questions about the death of the group still have no answers.


Today I want to talk about secrets. Why can't we still give a clear answer to how and why the Dyatlov group died? The first question is, in your opinion, what is the main mystery of their death?

 

Kireyev, Aleksandrov, Karelin / Bartolomey, Korolev, Koskin.

[KOSKIN]: We do not have complete information about what happened there...

– You did not collect the information?
[KOSKIN]: No. All researchers and version builders base their theory on the criminal case that was found in the archive in 1989. This case is obviously incomplete, it was closed. This raises many questions. People try to somehow solve these questions, and thousands of versions appear.




– And if there was a complete criminal case, would we know everything? Or would there still be mysteries?

[KOSKIN]: If the authorities said: such a rocket fell there, or something else happened there, then the mystery would disappear, and the aura too. It would simply turn into a memory of the dead.

[KARELIN]: I will say something else. In my opinion, the problem is that there are not enough specific real facts. There are no facts that can be reliably used as a basis.

– But there are facts that are known and just raise questions, because they do not fit into a single picture of death. And that is why there are 100 versions.

[KARELIN]: These facts are few and insufficient. And that is why a lot of other versions arise.

[KOSKIN]: The most important facts that are difficult to explain with these versions are severe injuries. The origin of these injuries can be explained in any number of ways, but their origin is still unclear.

– Doesn't the avalanche version explain these injuries? A heavy layer of snow came down and crushed them there.

[KOROLYOV]: I was a participant in several winter expeditions. We checked the snow, its depth and density. We all came to the conclusion that an avalanche could not have occurred there. The terrain was not conducive, the snow depth, the layering.
   

[KARELIN]: I arrived at the scene of the tragedy with the first helicopter (in 1959). And for two days (February 27-28) we felt around the tent with our hands. There were no signs of an avalanche!


[KIREEV]: About injuries. Injuries from avalanches and falls – they have been well studied. And the injuries described in the autopsy, in the study, they do not correspond at all to injuries from avalanches and falls.

– An avalanche is soft snow. There is a version that a hard crust came off there.

[KIREEV]: This is one of the versions, but it is also untenable.

[KOSKIN]: The question is not whether it is hard snow or soft snow. This year, another doctor (Andrey Gavrilov) went to Dyatlov Pass. And he concluded that people with such injuries cannot be transported.

[KOROLYOV]: Not only a doctor. He was an experienced person who works as a surgeon in emergency medicine, he has 24 years of experience. And he said – it's impossible! It's simply impossible!

[KOSKIN]: There are already a dozen such conclusions from doctors.

– This is one of the mysteries for me. It turns out that these people with severe injuries walked 1.5 km down in deep snow in the dark. It is difficult for a healthy person to walk this, but they did it.

[KOSKIN]: What happens? The injuries were received below.
[BARTHOLOMEY]: The main mystery remains – what made them jump out of the tent? What external force made them run down? We need to figure this out. How did they get their injuries? If you run in the dark in this area, you're bound to fall and hit something.



– But not so much that it would crush your head...

[BARTHOLOMEI]: What made them run down?

– Explain to me, please! It's a mystery to me, what made them run barefoot in the snow? When I go outside in the winter, if I'm in a hurry, I might not get dressed, but I'll definitely put on shoes. And why did they run barefoot?

(Noise of discussion.)

[KOROLYOV]: We conducted an experiment on our expedition, it was all filmed on video, when one person walked these one and a half kilometers in his socks before our eyes. Moreover, he was dragging a load (40 kg) with him, imitating a wounded person. He told us, having reached the cedar, that there was no problem walking barefoot or in socks. He didn't even freeze. This situation has been tested in practice. But the question is that after leaving the tent you will still try to put on your shoes.

– And that's what I'm talking about, as an automatic action.

[KOROLYOV]: Yes, they would start putting on shoes. Moreover, on a winter night it is colder than during the day. So it's a mystery.

[KIREEV]: If a person did not put on shoes, it means there was panic. There simply can’t be any other explanation for why people left without shoes. Again, cuts on the tent. They did not use the exit.

– And the exit was open. Two people were on duty, so they were wearing shoes. I want to show the most official version of the death of the Dyatlov group, which exists.

[/] At a press conference with journalists (in Moscow in 2020), prosecutor Andrei Kuryakov announced the completion of the investigation into the death of the tourists. He stated that the cause of the death of the Dyatlov group was an avalanche that descended on them, and at the moment this version is final and irrevocable. As it turned out later, these statements were not coordinated with the Prosecutor General's Office. Mr. Kuryakov received a reprimand, and later he was dismissed from the supervisory authorities.

– It turns out that this is not the version of the prosecutor's office, because the prosecutor told this on his own initiative. It was not officially confirmed. However, it was a man in uniform who said: yes, we conducted a study, the snow melted there.

[KOSKIN]: Tell me, how often do people in uniform tell us something on their own initiative?



[BARTOLOMEY]: How did the icy tracks appear? They were not caused by an avalanche! There was some kind of thermal or chemical effect on the snow. This is what needs to be discussed!

– But since the snow did not change color, it was unlikely to be a chemical effect.

[KARELIN]: I will add. They could have fallen on an icy section there.

– So, you support the idea that they ran barefoot down, they fell there, and that is why they received these injuries?

[KARELIN]: Yes! I am convinced. I saw this myself during the search. I kicked these tracks – and they were icy! How could icy tracks have formed? That is why I support Pyotr. There was some kind of powerful physical impact.

[BARTHOLOMEY]: Chemical impact!

– If it was a chemical impact, would there have been some color left?

[KOROLYOV]: There would definitely have been color.

[BARTHOLOMEY]: Wait, what do you mean by chemical impact?

– If rocket fuel spilled. That's what we're talking about.

[BARTHOLOMEY]: If you sprinkle salt, the snow becomes soft. That's a chemical impact. That's what I'm talking about now. Some kind of chemical substances from the rocket, for example...

– Father Elijah! I want you to say something.
   


Priest [ALEXANDROV]: For me, the main mystery is, of course, the people's veneration. Because all these details, how they died, how much time passed from the moment of fright until their blessed end – many here will argue.


The people venerate them. I witnessed how Sheremet's stories appeared, how Anna Aleksandrovna Matveyeva's book about the Dyatlov Pass was written. But this means nothing compared to the people's veneration. People went (to church), people prayed, people asked to remember them in prayers. And this has nothing to do with the fact that the prosecutor's office is conducting an investigation.

– Why do you think people react like this?

Ilia [ALEXANDROV]: It seems to me that, according to the Gospel, this is an act that shows that they are people with a capital letter. This does not happen often. They showed with their lives and deaths what it means to be faithful to the end.



Ведущий Евгений [ЕНИН] в новом телешоу на ОТВ к 65-летию: Тайна гибели группы Дятлова: 5 лет молчания. Какая тайна скрывается в горах Урала? (26 марта 2024). Некоторые комментарии я добавил в скобках:
   
– Это программа «Все говорят об этом». Мы все уже десятки лет не перестаём говорить о тайне гибели группы Дятлова – главной тайне и загадке Урала. Мы сегодня ещё раз вспомним, что случилось 65 лет назад, и расскажем вам, на какие вопросы о гибели группы до сих пор нет ответов.


Поговорить я сегодня хочу о тайнах. Почему мы до сих пор не можем дать однозначный ответ, как и почему погибла группа Дятлова? Первый вопрос – в чём, по-вашему, главная загадка их гибели?

 
Киреев, Александров, Карелин / Бартоломей, Королёв, Коськин.

[КОСЬКИН]: У нас нет полной информации о том, что там произошло...

– Информацию не собрали?
[КОСЬКИН]: Нет. Все исследователи и построители версий базируются на уголовном деле. которое было найдено в архиве в 1989 году. Это дело очевидно неполное, оно купированное. Это вызывает много вопросов. Люди пытаются эти вопросы как-то решить, и появляются тысячи версий.



– А если было бы полное уголовное дело, то мы бы всё знали? Или всё равно остались бы загадки?

[КОСЬКИН]: Если бы власти сказали: там упала такая ракета, или что иное там произошло, то загадка бы исчезла, и аура тоже. Это просто превратилось бы в память о погибших.

[КАРЕЛИН]: Я скажу другое. На мой взгляд, проблема в том, что недостаточно конкретных реальных фактов. Нет фактов, которые можно надёжно положить в основу.

– Но есть факты, которые известны и как раз вызывают вопросы, потому что они не ложатся в единую картину гибели. И поэтому 100 версий есть.

[КАРЕЛИН]: Этих фактов мало и недостаточно. И поэтому возникает масса других версий.

[КОСЬКИН]: Самые главные факты, которые этими версиями с трудом объясняются, это тяжёлые травмы. Происхождение этих травм можно по-всякому объяснять, но их происхождение до сих пор не понятно.

– Разве лавинная версия не объясняет эти травмы? Сошёл тяжёлый снежный пласт и придавил их там.

[КОРОЛЁВ]: Я был участник нескольких зимних экспедиций. Мы проверяли снег, его глубину и плотность. Мы все пришли к выводу, что лавина там сойти не может. Рельеф не способствует, глубина снега, слоистость.
   
[КАРЕЛИН]: Я прибыл на место трагедии с первым вертолётом (в 1959). И в течение двух дней (27-28 февраля) мы вокруг палатки всё руками прощупали. Никаких следов схода лавины не было!


[КИРЕЕВ]: Про травмы. Травмы от лавин и от падений – они хорошо изучены. И травмы, которые описаны во вскрытии трупов, в исследовании, они полностью не соответствуют травмам при лавинах и падениях.

– Лавина – это мягкий снег. Есть версия, что там сошёл твёрдый наст.

[КИРЕЕВ]: Это одна из версий, но она тоже несостоятельна.

[КОСЬКИН]: Вопрос не в том, что твёрдый снег или мягкий снег. В этом году на перевал Дятлова ходил очередной врач (Андрей Гаврилов). И он сделал заключение, что с такими травмами люди не транспортабельны.

[КОРОЛЁВ]: Не только врач. Это был опытный человек, который работает хирургом в экстренной медицине, его стаж 24 года. И он сказал – это невозможно! Это просто невозможно!

[КОСЬКИН]: Есть уже десяток таких заключений от врачей.

– Это для меня одна из загадок. Получается, что эти люди с тяжёлыми травмами прошли 1,5 км вниз по глубокому снегу в темноте. Здоровому человеку сложно это пройти, а они прошли.

[КОСЬКИН]: Что получается? Травмы были получены внизу.
[БАРТОЛОМЕЙ]: Самая главная загадка остаётся – что заставило их выскочить из палатки? Что за внешнее воздействие, которое заставило их бежать вниз? Здесь нам надо разбираться. А как они получили травмы? Если бежать в темноте по этой местности, ты там обязательно упадёшь и обо что-то стукнешься.



– Но не так, чтобы это голову сплющило...

[БАРТОЛОМЕЙ]: Что заставило их бежать вниз?

– Объясните мне, пожалуйста! Для меня загадка, что заставило их бежать босиком по снегу? Когда я выхожу зимой на улицу, если я очень тороплюсь, я могу не одеться, но я обязательно обуюсь. А они почему босиком бежали?

(Шум обсуждения.)

[КОРОЛЁВ]: У нас в экспедиции был проведён эксперимент, это всё снято на видео, когда один человек на наших глазах прошёл в носках эти полтора километра. Причём он с собой тащил груз (40 кг), имитируя им раненого человека. Он сказал нам, дойдя до кедра, то проблемы идти босиком или в носках нет. Он даже не замёрз. Эта ситуация была проверена практически. Но вопрос в том, что выйдя из палатки вы всё равно будете пытаться надеть обувь.

– А об этом и говорю, как действие на автомате.

[КОРОЛЁВ]: Да, натягивать обувь они бы стали. Там более, в зимнюю ночь это холоднее, чем днём. Поэтому это загадка.

[КИРЕЕВ]: Если человек не обулся. значит, возникла паника. Иного объяснения, что люди ушли без обуви, быть просто не может. Опять же, порезы на палатке. Они не воспользовались выходом.

– А выход был открыт. Два человека были дежурными, поэтому они были обуты. Я хочу показать самую официальную версию гибели группы Дятлова, которая есть.

[/] На пресс-конференции с журналистами (в Москве в 2020 году), прокурор Андрей Курьяков объявил о завершении расследования гибели туристов. Он заявил, что причиной смерти группы Дятлова стала сошедшая на них лавина, и на данный момент эта версия является окончательной и бесповоротной. Как выяснилось позже, эти заявления не были согласованы с Генпрокуратурой. Господин Курьяков получил выговор, а позже он был уволен из надзорных органов.

– Получается, это не версия прокуратуры, потому что прокурор рассказывал это по своей инициативе. Это не было закреплено официально. Тем не менее, это был человек в погонах, который рассказал: да, мы провели исследование, там сошёл снег.

[КОСЬКИН]: Скажите, а насколько часто люди в погонах рассказывают нам что-то по своей инициативе?

[БАРТОЛОМЕЙ]: Как появились ледяные следы? Это не от лавины они появились! Там было какое-то тепловое или химическое воздействие на снег. Вот это надо обсуждать!

– Но поскольку снег не изменился по цвету, это вряд ли химическое воздействие было.

[КАРЕЛИН]: Я добавлю. Они там могли упасть на ледяном участке.

– Значит, вы поддерживаете идею, что они побежали босиком вниз, они там упали, и поэтому они получили эти травмы?

[КАРЕЛИН]: Да! Я убеждён. Я сам увидел это во время поисков. Я бил ногой эти следы – а они ледяные! Как могли образоваться ледяные следы? Поэтому я поддерживаю Петра. Было какое-то мощное физическое воздействие.

[БАРТОЛОМЕЙ]: Химическое воздействие!

– Если это химическое воздействие, остался бы цвет какой-то?

[КОРОЛЁВ]: Обязательно цвет был бы.

[БАРТОЛОМЕЙ]: Подождите, что значит химическое воздействие?

– Если ракетное топливо разлилось. Мы об этом говорим.

[БАРТОЛОМЕЙ]: Если соль насыпать, то снег становится мягким. Это химическое воздействие. Я об этом сейчас говорю. Какие-то химические вещества от ракеты, допустим...

– Отец Илия! Я хочу, чтобы вы что-то сказали.
   
Иерей [АЛЕКСАНДРОВ]: Для меня самая главная загадка, конечно, народное почитание. Потому что все эти детали, как они умерли, сколько прошло времени с момента испуга и до их блаженной кончины, – многие здесь будет спорить.


Народ их почитает. Я был свидетелем, как сюжеты Шеремета появлялись, как была написана книга Анны Александровны Матвеевой про перевал Дятлова. Но это ничего не значит по сравнению с народным почитанием. Люди шли (в церковь), люди молились, люди просили помянуть их в молитвах. И это никак не связано с тем, что прокуратура проводит расследование.

– Как, по-вашему, почему такая реакция людей?

Илия [АЛЕКСАНДРОВ]: Мне кажется, по-евангельски это поступок, который показывает в них людей с большой буквы. Это не часто происходит. Они показали своей жизнью и смертью, что значит быть верными до конца.



2
General Discussion / Re: An Argument For (Pro) A Fight
« Last post by ahabmyth on July 17, 2025, 11:53:14 PM »
By the sound of it if there was going to be some bad blood it would be between Igor and Zolo two leaders of men, and just maybe Zolo didnt like taking orders from a guy 15yrs his younger but more experienced Igor as we could see in the picture off Zolo on the frozen river on the way to Kolat Syakhl.

I feel that Zolo would have been used to taking orders being in the army but I suppose with his freedom from them, he has unleashed new freedoms hinself..
We can but dream.
3
General Discussion / Re: So I asked AI about the topic...
« Last post by SURI on July 17, 2025, 09:37:43 AM »
Whatever Zolotaryov had a camera or just a case, both are strange. The case itself is even more strange, especially with it wrapped around his hand. It is also strange that the thing itself was not mentioned in the files at all. If it weren't for the photo, we wouldn't even know.
4
Lightning strike / Ball lightning / Re: Ivanov Later Believed In Ball Lightning
« Last post by ahabmyth on July 17, 2025, 03:47:59 AM »
Ball Lightening.There should be a good video of this phenomenon on Youtube by now. It shows a ball on the side of a railway track.
Ball Lightning I suspect is a lightening strike that dosnt quite make contact with the ground but shows in a ball before dissipating.
You will note that lightning will always go via the shortest path , this is why there are lightening conductors.
5
Yeti / Snowman / Re: Alternative Yeti Theorie
« Last post by ahabmyth on July 17, 2025, 03:28:18 AM »
Oh dear the poor guy has to go for a dump and everyone suggests strange poses. In the picture he is joking with the cameraman and poses for him just pulling up his trousers. You can clearly see a hole in the snow in front of the guy with the strange pose.
6
UFO / Re: The Cash-Landrum incident
« Last post by ahabmyth on July 17, 2025, 03:04:03 AM »
From what I remember this case was  a couple of fishermen on the Eastern seaboard seeing a UFO. Whilst it seemed a bit Iffy to me the older guy admitted later that he didnt go inside this craft.
7
General Discussion / Re: Cover-up
« Last post by GlennM on July 16, 2025, 08:22:38 PM »
My take on this is that you do not pinch the Bear (or pull the tiger's whiskers). The authorities will accept a degree of criticism and the authorities will find someone to blame. This was all done.I suspect it would be worse in Stalin's time. What the families want is closure, explanation and accountability if it is to be had.

What we do not have is a history of the families confronted the Dyatlov family for Igor's failings as a leader. It appears that it was generally accepted that the tragedy was the result of a natural calamity.  What the government wants is to avoid mourners becoming a rabble. It only takes a few people like Yuri Yuden to start mouthing military conspiracy to whip up a crowd. Small wonder his involvement was limited and his comments kept more or less to himself. The government spent money to resolve the tragedy and honor the dead. The hiking area was restricted out of an abundance of caution, I think.

I believe cover up equates to a deliberate suppression of truth. I do not get that in this matter. Instead, I see people being pulled away from their occupations trying to resolve and put to rest an unfortunate winter tragedy in the remote mountains of Russia. Errors were made, but the case was closed and life moved on....except for those few of us who still want to know the "why" of it.
8
General Discussion / Re: So I asked AI about the topic...
« Last post by Ziljoe on July 16, 2025, 07:35:44 PM »
Zolotaryov was not the only one who went hiking with a camera, but at the time of the incident, only Zolotaryov had a camera. Here I would rather ask the question, what did he need it for? I think Zolotaryov's camera was supposed to document something completely different, so it was necessary for him to have it with him at the time of the incident.


Regarding the whole incident, these 3 points are important to me.

1) Krivonischenko's last picture
2) Slobodin's one shoe
3) Zolotaryov's camera and subsequent pictures

Even if they all carried their camera during the day, they were settling into the tent and took the cameras and several layers of clothing off.
Zolotarev I think knew he would head out again, and Tibo agreed to go with him - so they stayed mostly in their day clothes.
Now again, the 8 were a group of friends, Tibo probably thought, like you did, that the camera might get in the way, but he feels perfectly safe leaving his camera with the others.
Zolotarev probably even subconsciously didn't want to leave his camera in the care of strangers. There were nice views from that slope, unfortunately those photos were destroyed, but what reason is there to think it was sinister?
I think the one shoe, that's all he had time to put on.
And Krivo's picture looks like someone put their hand over the lens. This could have happened at any time, there are other botched photos in the group cameras. Maybe one of the original searches primed the camera and thought oops i shouldn't have done that. cover the lens and took a shot.

There is a lot do deal with here and previous postings. It has been interesting.

I'm still not sure that Zolotaryov had a camera on him. Other than the photo with what looks like a camera, I can't recall the case files saying he was found with a camera ( someone please correct me).

I can understand the argument for collecting wood...but.... You would take the axe and saw , you wouldn't know the availability of dry wood , even if the intention was to break branches, the wood would need processed. That is why they have more than one axe and a saw.

The argument for falling from 5 meters is probably more like 3 meters , although the guestamation is broken branches is at 5 meters , it allows to be standing on a branch at 3 meters to break branches at 5 meters. Not that that matters for the argument of falling .

I would not let any of my group go for wood without the tools needed, I would also expect them to carry torches ( flashlights), gloves , back pack etc.

The violence of the cut on the tent also doesn't warrant a rational reaction to hearing shouts from anyone in distress. The nature of the cuts to the tent would not be easily repaired on field conditions. Any frustration by those inside , it would be easier to cut the door toggles.

Even if the rest of the group reacted to shouts for help, they would take blankets, clothing  , axes, rope, gloves , jackets ,footwear etc.

If there was an emergency and they didn't take their equipment it is like calling the fire brigade and they over react and turn up in their socks whilst forgetting to bring the fire engine .

However, it is still an interesting concept. I would argue that the should or could have taken wood supplies with them from the last camp..

By the way, you have an axe to make the wood small, for carrying and fitting in the stove. Noone would slash a tent to cool off. Canvas is strong but some of your thoughts don't make sense to me.

I'm also getting confused by the bear incident, there are different types of bears and the story of the challenging the bear is not detailed . You don't slash your tent when you have a normal exit , you would only cut it if it was the only option.

That's my thoughts,.
9
General Discussion / Re: So I asked AI about the topic...
« Last post by ZuriDog on July 16, 2025, 11:02:26 AM »
Zolotaryov was not the only one who went hiking with a camera, but at the time of the incident, only Zolotaryov had a camera. Here I would rather ask the question, what did he need it for? I think Zolotaryov's camera was supposed to document something completely different, so it was necessary for him to have it with him at the time of the incident.


Regarding the whole incident, these 3 points are important to me.

1) Krivonischenko's last picture
2) Slobodin's one shoe
3) Zolotaryov's camera and subsequent pictures

Even if they all carried their camera during the day, they were settling into the tent and took the cameras and several layers of clothing off.
Zolotarev I think knew he would head out again, and Tibo agreed to go with him - so they stayed mostly in their day clothes.
Now again, the 8 were a group of friends, Tibo probably thought, like you did, that the camera might get in the way, but he feels perfectly safe leaving his camera with the others.
Zolotarev probably even subconsciously didn't want to leave his camera in the care of strangers. There were nice views from that slope, unfortunately those photos were destroyed, but what reason is there to think it was sinister?
I think the one shoe, that's all he had time to put on.
And Krivo's picture looks like someone put their hand over the lens. This could have happened at any time, there are other botched photos in the group cameras. Maybe one of the original searches primed the camera and thought oops i shouldn't have done that. cover the lens and took a shot.
10
Non-DP Related Mysteries! / Re: Lake Bodom Murders
« Last post by ahabmyth on July 16, 2025, 07:37:23 AM »
Something strange how this happened and I cant get around the fact that this killer managed at all to do this from outside the tent.
I dont care what size tent you have the laws of physics remain. So imagine someone close upto the tent what do they do get on their knees and strike at where they think the persons head or trunk is, if they dont know in which orientation the kids are sleeping in the first strike could miss and go between their legs or if the legs were stabbed they would instantly wake up screaming. So in order to strike from outside I don't think that is what it truly means ( I haven't seen the other side of the tent) the tent must have been cut first before the mayhem begun. Also the time, which could have been at sunrise but the killer wouldn't want anyone to see him so must lean more towards the 4am ish time.
So I believe the attack happened at 4am with the killer kneeling on the grass and slashing open the tent and aiming for the kids upper chest to stop them from screaming. I don't think this was an off the cuff murder but pre-planned the killer must have watched them for a few days particulary at sunset.
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